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Fladiver64
07-21-2014, 01:47 PM
Not sure if this is the best place to post or not since I don't have a project car yet. I have been doing some research and planning and have a basic outline of the project, but I am still working out the details as well as looking for a vehicle. What I am looking to build is a 57 4 door HT, but may do a post car if I can't find a good HT. I have two boys 11 and 12 that are going to work with me, passing the tradition down from me working with my Dad on his 27 and 34 Fords.

Basic outline is as follows:
1. Classic Edge clips, thanks to Chevynut for answering a bunch of questions, I am sure there will be a lot more to come.
2. LS motor with either a 6l80 or T56. Depends on when you ask me if I have a real preference. Looking to find a low mileage engine trans takeout with computer, wiring harness and sensors complete.
3. Body modifications will include, shaved door handles, mod/smooth front bumper with 57 corvette grill teeth. I would like to remove the wind wings and make one piece front windows. I have seen this done on the post cars and I know the hard top will be more difficult but I think it is possible.
4. Interior will be buckets in front Cadillac? Still undecided on rear. Custom build center console, and the most radical part is I want to install a 56 dash. I really like the 57 exterior but I like the 56 dash much better.

There are a bunch of more details to work out and I like to have a reasonable plan to start with before getting a project under way, and yes I know the plan will change as the car gets built. I am looking forward to getting advice from the experienced builders out there. I am a decent engineer and fabricator and I think these ideas are within my capability to get finished.

One of the first steps is finding a car to work on, and trying to find the sweet spot between tearing apart a good running driving car and trying to resurrect someone else's rust pile project. As with most people here this project has budget considerations in both time and money. I think I need to find a car that is at least mostly complete as things like all of the little/big trim parts can run up a big tab. I am prepared to do some rust repair but sometimes spending a bit more for a better starting car is less expensive in the long run. Since I am planning on replacing all of the running gear I don't really want to pay for a car that someone has done this already just to take it all out. Of course you can sell some of those items but it never seems that you get as much as you think you should and there is a significant amount of time spent selling those parts.

Here are some cars I found on fleabay as examples, and yes there is always a difference between what they say and what they look like in person but what would you think about these examples and where else are good places to look for project cars. I troll ebay, CL and Hemmings, but seams to be more finished cars rather than projects.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-Chevy-Sedan-6-Cylinder-engine-4-speed-Trans-Runs-good-Affordable-/201128036618?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=y3tisArXBT6lRN0TWDCuUKwTrKM%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-Chevy-Bel-Air-4-door-6-cylinder-automatic-transmission-/121375780416?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=y3tisArXBT6lRN0TWDCuUKwTrKM%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
Owner says they want $4500 for this one but scary when they admit to lots of rust.
Thanks for reading my rambling, and I am looking forward to the sage advice :)

rockytopper R.I.P 5-13-2017
07-21-2014, 03:49 PM
Not sure what budget you have or were you are located but I know of a very nice solid 56 nomad for sale here local. It is 100% complete except needs a back seat all trim is there. no engine or trans perfect for ls transplant. Can be had in the 15k range. If interested I can give you contact info.
Rocky

Fladiver64
07-21-2014, 06:08 PM
Rocky, thanks for the offer, I am looking for the 4dr HT, the nomads are cool but not what I had in mind for this build. Budget is a moving target better cars that need less work are worth more but I dont want to start cutting up a good paint job to shave the doors or start modifying bumpers that have good chrome. I think I am leaning more in the under 10K project car direction but thanks for the heads up.

rockytopper R.I.P 5-13-2017
07-21-2014, 06:45 PM
Good luck in your search i like 4 dr ht's great to see father & son projects!!
We will be in your home town in oct in our 65 cutlass
Rocky

Rick_L
07-21-2014, 07:02 PM
Here's my take on those Ebay ads. They admit to a lot of rust. That means it's worse than they say, and likely are worth half or less than the asking price. You should be able to buy a fairly nice 4dr sedan for that money or just a little more, not a rust bucket. 4dr hardtops are worth a little more but that's one car I wouldn't want to build from a rust bucket. I think if you are patient you can find a 4dr ht that's a better builder. Keep in mind that some resto parts for a 4dr ht are not repro'd unless they came out recently. Things like the center and rear floor pan braces. So check that out, and if you can't get those pieces, buy a car that either has them intact or has enough left that you can work with it.

Not sure how you'd mod 57 bumpers to do anything. A new grille won't require bumper work. Eliminating the vent window on a ht will be a lot of work to make it nice. Think that through before you commit.

Fladiver64
07-21-2014, 09:37 PM
Rick, Thanks for the input, your evaluation was about what my gut told me, but nice to have it validated. I am going to be patient and keep looking for the right car, not just any car. Thanks for the input n the floor pan braces, are there other particular items that I need to be looking at that are not made or more difficult to repair?

Yes i am aware that the vent window elimination is going to be a big challenge to make right but sometimes that is what makes it worthwhile.

carls 56 (RIP 11/24/2021)
07-22-2014, 05:15 AM
sounds like you have this well thought out. I like the idea of a father-sons project the most, great idea. just another option: might be good to get a driver, will help to keep the young guys interested and motivated. best of luck and fun with whatever you get.

Bihili
07-22-2014, 07:31 AM
http://springfield.craigslist.org/cto/4558858143.html

http://springfield.craigslist.org/cto/4558644357.html

chevynut
07-22-2014, 07:44 AM
Bill, I think he's looking for a project car, not a completed car. Those are some high-dollar cars you linked.

Fladiver, are you looking for a 4-door because you prefer them or because you are wanting a less-expensive project? What's your budget for the car?

Fladiver64
07-22-2014, 10:48 AM
4 door because with a wife and 2 kids I want a car that we will use and drive. The 4 door makes getting in the back seat much easier, my 12 year old is already 5'6 so by the time he is 18 climbing over the front seat may not seem to be as much fun. The less expensive project portion helps but not sure how much that really applies especially since I would prefer a HT, I could save money by going to a post car. Right now the budget is still a consideration and a bit of a moving target, part of the reason i put this post up to determine what I need to spend. I am thinking between 5K to 8K for the car with an overall budget of $40K over a 4 to 5 year build time. If that proves unrealistic then I will have to adjust my expectations.

Right now I can be patient as I will not have a place to work on the car until December, I also tend to be someone that likes to to a bit of research and see what the market is like so I can evaluate what is a good deal or not.

Carl, I have thought about the idea of getting a driver, but then one of the first things to do is take the frame out and put the C4 clips in. Once the car is that far a part it is hard to justify putting it back together not finished. Still a thought and right now I am open to ideas from others with experience.
Bill, those are nice cars but I am looking for something to work on and I think those are much too nice to do what I want. Part of what I enjoy is the construction and building so I would feel bad about taking someone elses car apart that they worked on so hard.

Thanks guys for all of the feedback I am sure this forum will be a big help for this project.

chevynut
07-22-2014, 09:38 PM
This looks like a helluva nice car for $18K. It's not a project, but could save you a lot of work and money.

http://www.cars-on-line.com/74062.html

Here's a good-looking 4 door sedan....looks solid.

http://amarillo.craigslist.org/cto/4550927909.html

Personally, I think the black and white one you linked is worth a closer look. I don't know what the reserve is, but it doesn't look that rusty to me in the pics he posted. Ask for pics of the bottom if you're interested and of the rusty areas.

Here's a pretty good 4DHT:

http://www.cars-on-line.com/72315.html

Here's a cheap rusty one:

http://www.cars-on-line.com/35197.html

Whatever you get, make sure the 4-door HT specific parts are there... They're hard to find. However, there is a local yard here that has several of them in it...at least the last time I was there.

BTW, if you end up getting serious about a 4-door sedan let me know. I have a really nice original AZ car with around 49K showing on the odometer that I'd like to sell. It's a 210 sedan with a PP 283 and 3-speed. Not sure about the price at this time, but it's one of the most solid "survivor" 57's I've ever seen. Maybe it's nicer than you'd like to start out with.

3272

567chevys
07-23-2014, 10:25 AM
That is a nice 57 you have Laszlo



Sid

Fladiver64
07-23-2014, 12:26 PM
Laszlo,

Thanks for the leads they all look like nice cars. I guess there is a part of me saying why should i buy a driver when what I will be using is the frame and body. In my plan the entire suspension and driveline will be replaced as well as the interior. I am not sure what the value of those components would be on the used market since the car I would buy would not be in top shape. On the other side of the coin is once they stop being driven the cars then to deteriorate and parts go missing. I need to find some cars that are closer to me so I can go see them and get a feel for how big of a project some of these cars are.

The black and white car on ebay, I emailed the owner and he want $4500 for a reserve. I think that is a bit high for that car plus the transport costs back to Fl

Fladiver64
07-31-2014, 08:38 PM
Well faster than I thought I have found a project car. 57 Belair 4 door Hardtop, very solid body, needs outer rockers and some minor rust repair in other areas. Has been media blasted, primed and stored indoors for the last 7 years. It includes all of the stainless trim, a 283, powerglide, front and rear seats. There are boxes of new parts that I did not have time to go through but I saw new chrome bullets, front bumper, and the rockets for the hood, new wiring harness. All for $3750, I think it was a good deal.

I have to help my mom move next week so I cant go pick it up until the week after,Now I just have to arrange a trailer and truck to go get it.

chevynut
08-01-2014, 06:16 AM
Congrats Fladiver! Looks like a nice start to a project, and for a great price! Keep us posted on progress.

shua57
08-01-2014, 07:10 AM
Nice, it's alot easier starting from a media blasted car. Have Chevynut build you a C4 frame while it's all apart:). I have a 4 door sitting at my house for my 16 year old, for some reason I like them. Good luck and keep us updated.
Josh

Fladiver64
08-01-2014, 07:13 PM
C4 clips from Chevynut are on the build plan. Next step for me is to get it on a trailer and towed home. Should be about 10 days or so before I can get it back here. The other issue that is going to slow things down a bit is I wont have a shop to work in until October/November range. I really did not expect to find a car so fast, just got lucky to find the right car for my project on the third car. I do have a rust question. There are some areas that are pitted but no holes in the sheet metal, one spot is behind where the Bel Air trim is installed and some along the roof when the door closes. How can you determine what needs to be replaced with a patch panel and when can you apply and encapsulator, prime and fill. I knwo some are going to say always put in new metal but this is not going to be a $100K car.

Mike

shua57
08-02-2014, 12:07 PM
Mike, if it is just pitted I would take care of it during filler day :). If it is rust it needs to not be, however you feel is necessary to remove or replace it. I not a fan of rust encapsulator under body paint. There are all kinds of chemical reaction problems, etc, that could happen. The rust needs to be gone, pits can be solved with filler unless you are dead set on no pits then a panel replacement is in order. Good luck with it, drive it till the wheels fall off, don't let it sit in a garage like my car has for the last 5 years. Get us some pics when you can, I would like to see it since I still have my 16 year old's to do. I want to flat red it and dropped but he won't let me, it has to be blue. At least eh has picked out a blue close to the old school stock teal...lol.
Josh

Fladiver64
08-03-2014, 11:19 AM
I got a truck and trailer ready for August 11th to go pick up our new project, all the boys in our house are excited to get started (yes even the older one). One of the Mods I want to make is installing a 55 or 56 dash in the 57, the PO of this car may have a donor for that swap so hopefully I will know early next week if we can get that part at the same time. Shua57, that is what I was leaning toward with the pitting, the rust should be gone as the car was media blasted and has been stored indoors for the last 7 years iwth no signs of recurrence.

My first goals are to reassemble the front end, and place all of the trim on temporarily, just to make sure we have all of the parts. Then evaluate what parts we need and what we can get done. The front and rear clips on from Chevynut are on the list but I need wait until I get a shop finished so we have a place to take the body off and work on the frame.

Chevynut, I am sure you can answer this. I would like to start working on the body, if I bolt everything to this frame to get straight , when I replace the front clip with the C4 clip should everything bolt up in the same place? Having not put one of these together before I am not sure how much adjustment there is making everything fit.

Thanks

Mike

Fladiver64
08-14-2014, 02:20 PM
My son Brandon went with me earlier this week to pick up our new project. Got it home without incident and proceeded to unpack the trailer to see what we really got. Found a few more rust spots but nothing that can't be fixed. We spend the day cleaning the "barn" off the barn find. Then packed everything away to the storage unit where it will sit until the shop is finished, hopefully by November. We still plan on getting some work done between now and then but we are limited on what we can do onsite. I din't take a picture of the parts until we had put more than half of the stainless trim away. Looks like we got most of it, but inventory will be one of the first tasks.

JT56
08-15-2014, 07:16 AM
My son Brandon went with me earlier this week to pick up our new project. Got it home without incident and proceeded to unpack the trailer to see what we really got. Found a few more rust spots but nothing that can't be fixed. We spend the day cleaning the "barn" off the barn find. Then packed everything away to the storage unit where it will sit until the shop is finished, hopefully by November. We still plan on getting some work done between now and then but we are limited on what we can do onsite. I din't take a picture of the parts until we had put more than half of the stainless trim away. Looks like we got most of it, but inventory will be one of the first tasks.


Didnt waste anytime! Good to see

carls 56 (RIP 11/24/2021)
08-16-2014, 06:05 AM
nice, have fun with it. :cool:

WagonCrazy
08-16-2014, 05:42 PM
Great find! Now hurry up and get that shop finished, so you and your boys can start the project. They will be done with high school and off to college before you know it. The clock is ticking.....

tick tock tick tock tick tock... :p

567chevys
08-17-2014, 08:49 PM
Looks like a big project , but what I really like is the smile on your son's face . Glad to see the younger ones still like the old cars !!


Sid

Fladiver64
08-18-2014, 05:13 PM
Great find! Now hurry up and get that shop finished, so you and your boys can start the project. They will be done with high school and off to college before you know it. The clock is ticking.....

tick tock tick tock tick tock... :p

We re going to start by some re assemble for inventory purpose, and then start bringing doors home a couple at a time to go through, as well as starting the long job of polishing stainless trim. RIght now biggest hold up on the shop in the county.

Fladiver64
08-18-2014, 05:15 PM
Looks like a big project , but what I really like is the smile on your son's face . Glad to see the younger ones still like the old cars !!


Sid

Our guess is 4 or 5 years and he is very excited, told everyone at scouts that we are going to be doing the auto maintenance merit badge this year so they can all work on it.

Bihili
08-19-2014, 07:25 AM
Rocky, thanks for the offer, I am looking for the 4dr HT, the nomads are cool but not what I had in mind for this build. Budget is a moving target better cars that need less work are worth more but I dont want to start cutting up a good paint job to shave the doors or start modifying bumpers that have good chrome. I think I am leaning more in the under 10K project car direction but thanks for the heads up.

FYI:
http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/4607958838.html