57 BelAir from Holland

[mrbelair]

It has been a while that I posted on 55/57 Chevy forums, but I collected my pics and will post some of my progress. The work took me a while, because it ain't easy in Europe building a hotrod or classic car. Shipping and import are expensive. When I have the money, I don't have the time and when I have time I don't have money...


But anyhow I sold my old chassis and then had the luck to find two one piece framerails of a '57 four door sedan here in Holland. I ordered the narrowed frame clip from Progressive Automotive with the parts for mounting the 1987 C4 Corvette front suspension.


Here is the old chassis with Ford 9" ladder bars and the C4 donor car in front


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/DSCN6440.jpg


The replacement frame rails and Progressive frontclip


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0248.jpg


I did not have a jig, so It was not easy to get started
I had lot's of measurements (my old chassis, factory frameplans etc) but none seem to correspond. Maybe I was to serious about measuring


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0250.jpg


I finally bit the bullet and just took the sizes that fitted my body best. There for I had to cut the bodybrackets of PA clip and reweld them in other places


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0453-1.jpg


I bought the Morrison crossmember, because I ilke that one the best
Used an old muffler to test if there was enough room for it


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0555_2.jpg


I studied numerous www pics and some place the rear crossmember in front of the body brackets and some in the back. I choose the later, but I cannot recall why anymore. The holes for the exhaust tubes are a crime to get in, especially those in the front that are angled


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0562.jpg


I test fitted the frame under my body and it worked out. The nose of the car and frontbumper all fit fine and are straight. I still have to mount the C4 IRS rear axle. I have bought the C4 rearkit from Laszlo/Classic Edge for it. I want my car to be low. My idea is that on most C4 builds I see the rearend sits too high to my liking. I will use Shockwaves all around and that will help a lot. But I want my 20 inch rear wheels deep in my mini tubs
Here are the rearaxle pieces after I cleaned them up


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0725_2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0739_2.jpg


That's it for now

[mrbelair]

Well I have done some work on my firewall as well. This Chevy used to have a 5 inch engine set-back from his Gasser history. There for the original firewall was pretty much butchered. I have lived with it for more then 20 years, but not anymore. I really liked the Direct Sheetmetal firewall, but at $450,- and pretty much the same amount for shipping plus some custom duties the total price would come over $1000,- so I decided to make one myself.


This was the original firewall, I counted some 60 plus holes in it


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0260_2.jpg




First I cut the butchered part out of the middle and welded plates over the left and right sides too shut all holes


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0427.jpg


This is the DS aftermarket firewall I liked. I looked at it and saw that it was basically made of two parts of bended sheetmetal


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/firewall2.jpg


So I bought two pieces of 1.5mm sheetmetal overhere and bended them to my liking


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0827.jpg


I welded them together and I think it looks nice (for just $60,-)


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0826.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/IMG_0829.jpg


Fitting to the body took some time, because the 57 model has an extra lip on top and is not quite symmetric


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-21.jpg


I have plenty of room now for most engines, but for now I stay with just a simple small block.
I would like to have an LS type engine in the future though...

[carls 56 (RIP 11/24/2021)]

nice job, looking good. :cool:

[chevynut]

Nice work MrBelair! I installed one of those Progressive clips a few years ago and it was a little scary to cut the frame in two. They're nice but the downside is you can't use the C4 rack or swaybar. The advantage is that you get a narrower wheel mounting surface. I think those firewalls are way too expensive for what you get. I also built mine for about $60.

Keep posting pics of your project!

[Seajinx]

Definitely looking good. Keep us posted on the progress.

[mrbelair]

I found some time to post an update of my project.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-18-1.jpg
This was the status of the last update. A Progressive Automotive framestub and AM crossmember fitted, now it's time for the C4 IRS rear axle


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-23-1.jpg
Here is my engine test fitted. For the rear I first went for the traditional set up, with the C4 batwing mounted under the tri-5 framerails.
However I was afraid that this didn't gave me the stance and the suspension travel I wanted


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-372.jpg?t=1419340442
So I made a wooden Jig for the independent axle with my tire height at ride height. I want to use 20" rims with 28/29" high tires and I want the body to sink over them


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-3612.jpg?t=1419340442
I decided to narrow the aluminum IRS batwing, so that it would fit between the framerails for a lower stance.
Here the batwing before welding, I think it's narrowed between 2 and 3 inch aside


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-12.jpg?t=1419416761
For more suspension travel I gave the framerails a C notch above the driveshafts.
It did ended up like this.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-31.jpg?t=1419341075
I made batwing brackets to fit the IRS with 3 possibilities in height, 1 inch apart. This is an upside pic of the frame rails

[mrbelair]

While cutting the frame rails open for the welding of the C Notch, I found that sometime ago a rodent used it for a living room


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-15.jpg?t=1419417851


I foreclosered his home and removed his stuff
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-23-2.jpg?t=1419417852

[mrbelair]

On the bottom side of the frame rails I had some 'not so nice' parts made by previous owners with jacks or jackstands
Not knowing how to pull out the dents and pits, I decided to cut the bad parts out and replace them with fresh and straight metal.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-2.jpg?t=1419418328


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-3-2.jpg


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-4.jpg?t=1419418330


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-5.jpg?t=1419418330

[mrbelair]

The downside of making the C notches in the frame rails is that the body must be modified too


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-35-1.jpg?t=1419418331
I measured and cut a big hole above the rear axle area
Also two small ones for the top C4 'dogbone' links
As you can see my body is mini tubbed, so there is plenty of room for big wheels and tires
The inside of the wheeltubs is covered with a thick layer of rubber from all the burnouts during the years...


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-32-1.jpg?t=1419418331
I had a 2mm sheetmetal plate bended to fill up the hole


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/taximan/57%20project/foto-33.jpg?t=1419418331
I welded this in between the minitubs and now there is enough room for the C4 axle, even in the lowest ride height position


Funny thing is that this is an ex-California car and not a single piece of original sheetmetal has ever been replaced.
All sheetmetal is original, but the body has been cut and welded many times for racing and streetrace purposes.
Firewall, trans tunnel, wheel tubs and now the thrunk bottom...

[5Clint7]

Man, you sure do work fast and do excellent work. Looking great.

[chevynut]

Mrbelair, I like how you narrowed the C4 batwing. I had a customer wanting a narrowed batwing because he's narrowing the suspension and we raised it higher in the frame than stock, and he went with one from a Viper. We raised the humps as well, so I don't even think he needed to do that. Unfortunately it's going to take a lot of welding and machining to make the Viper batwing fit the C4 center section casting. I think it would have been much easier to narrow the C4 batwing but I couldn't talk him into it. Someone told him they didn't think he should weld on it so he stuck with that.

I'm not sure I understand why you went with the notches in the frame. With the halfshafts level I have about 3 3/4" between the halfshaft and the bottom of the hump. Since it's an IRS, you actually get quite a bit more than 3 3/4" drop at the wheel. I did a frame once with Shockwaves and we were able to get it almost to the ground with a stock frame hump. I think the stroke of the shock was more of a limiter than the frame itself.

I assume you're going to raise the dogbone attach locations too? The top one should be level or slightly high in the front.

[mrbelair]

Most of the 57's with C4 IRS examples I see on the internet have (for my idea) a stance that is to high in the rear. Right now I want to use 20" rear wheels with a 285/40 tires that are 29" high and that adds up. I hate a too high stance with those big diameter wheels. Maybe I over did the notch a bit, but I better wanted to be save then sorry. The batwing has now 3 mounting holes each side and it looks like the lowest holes already give me the desired stance. I can still lower the car 1 or 2 inches with the upper holes. I know that the 4 link dog bones are not 100% in the right place, but when you lower a stock Corvette these locations will also change. For now I keep them like that. My Chevy will not be a serious autocross car, but I rather lay it on the ground at a car cruise.

38943895

Next up is making some sort of pinion support for the IRS and I am thinking in the lines these designs.
The mounting points of the shockwave rear shocks will also be a challenge.

38963897

Right now this is the stance at ride height and I think I can live with that

[chevynut]

Eric, with your adjustable ride height via moving the the batwing I would think you'd need to make an adjustable torque arm mount and adjustable dogbone mounts as well. At one time I had two holes for my batwing too, but I decided it complicated things too much so I picked one ride height and stuck with it.

This is the rear ride height on my C4 conversions. It's about 2 1/4" below stock suspension height, plus a 1" tire drop. The front is slightly lower than ride height since I haven't adjusted the coilovers yet and it's designed for a 3" suspension drop. Do you think this is too high in the rear?


3898 3899

I certainly understand your desire to drop it further but I'm actually worried about getting them too low for driveability. I think 4" at the frame is the lowest I'd go for ride height if a guy wants to drive the car.

I had one customer (my upholstery guy) who wanted his lower, so we did that for him. This frame has raised rear humps to accomplish an additional 1" suspension drop for a total of 3 1/4". It's designed so at ride height the top of a 55 wheelwell will sit on the top of the lug nut circle. Notice that the Viper batwing really didn't buy us anything since the humps were elongated. It will help with batwing to knuckle clearance. I could have put it higher in the frame but it wasn't necessary to get the ride height the customer wanted. We also raised the k-member an additional 1/2" to get the front down more, which I feel was unnecessary but that's what he wanted so I did it. :p


3900 3901 3902

This is what I did for a torque arm on my Nomad. It's more complicated than what you showed above which should work fine:

3903

[mrbelair]

Laszlo, my ride height will be adjustable but I am not planning of changing it every few weeks or so. When I am satisfied it will properly stay put. My plan is to make a pinion torque bracket with the same 3 adjustment holes, so they can move together if necessary. The dog bones will stay where they are for now, until they give me real problems.

The stance of your Nomad seems fine to me, but not radical. Are you using 17" or 18" wheels? My frame will have 4 inch ground play at ride height and no parts will hang below my frame rails. I have a 70 Chevelle with 4" ground play and can drive it around pretty much without troubles.

Nice job on that modified chassis. I also thought of narrowing my rear axle (for deeper wheels), but I am already way over my head in this project as it is for now. My $60 smooth firewall is finished and I am very happy with it

3904 3905

Thanks for your opinion and advice, I appreciate it very much. Your 56 project inspired me to do this C4 suspension conversion.

[chevynut]

Mrbelair, no my stance isn't radical but it's as low as I think you can drive the car. In the picture shown, the frame is only about 3" from the ground at the front of the door and it has a slight rake to it. It should be about 4" at designed ride height. The only way to get the rear any lower, as you know, is to narrow the batwing or notch the frame for the batwing.

If you don't move the dogbones up with the batwing so they're level or slightly high in front, it will affect the anti-squat characteristics of the car. I'm not sure how severe that is.

My rear wheels are 18x10.5" and the front are 17x8.5".