need some help ,looking for any advice on how or who to contact on straightening liftgate tried madmooks he has move and cant do gate any advice from anyone, last thing to do before paint
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need some help ,looking for any advice on how or who to contact on straightening liftgate tried madmooks he has move and cant do gate any advice from anyone, last thing to do before paint
The liftgate guy: Jerry Cabunoc, 1 (714) 457-1955
http://www.pontiacsafari.com/L1SafariFacts/Liftgat ...
Whatever you do, during liftgate reinstallation get rid of the torsion bars that help lift the gate and replace them with gas struts. The torsion bars are what causes the liftgates to distort over time, and if you continue to use them you'll be straightening it again.
Did you find someone to straighten your liftgate? I have the same problem. Madmooks is taking a break from doing them.
Madmooks (Michael) did mine about 2 years ago. Super nice job and super nice chroming too. But he's moved to AZ and is focusing on a different part of his business now. Too bad for those who need straightening. Try that Jerry Cabunoc guy. He has been doing them like forever, but I have no idea if he still does or not...
Jerry Carbunoc does still perform liftgate alignments; he always does so at the CNA/NNC conventions and i'm sure will do so for one sent to him..
There are also others who do this work; infact one in TN who has been recommended to me, and I've seen magazine ads for someone else out west who does them.
What happens to them that they need alignment? A small accident?
Distorted due to closing the liftgate, pulling against the stock torsion bars which are too strong. That's why you delete them after the liftgate is straightened and use the gas struts unless you have to have all original.
The liftgate is a pretty heavy piece, so I'm not sure you can say the torsion rods are "too strong". They do a good job of helping lift the liftgate. The issue is that the liftgate is pot metal and with the constant tension on the rods it eventually gets distorted as the top of the liftgate gets twisted. It happens to all Nomads. If you have it straightened, and don't remove the torsion rods, it will happen again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick_L
Here's mine before Madmooks:
Attachment 8976
Attachment 8978
And here's after Mike's straightening job:
Attachment 8977
Attachment 8979
I'd modify what CN said.. the liftgates are VERY heavy, especially with the glass and all supports installed...
The blame for the distortion these days is generally placed on the torsion rods, but for many many years Nomad drivers ran around with the liftgates in the UP position which used to be the reason given for the distortion and IMO probably plays a big part in the overall distortion seen in most gates.. (but I haven't seen a Nomad being driven with the liftgate up in a very long time).. :)
Hmm, I sort of understand. But I don't think I've ever seen one open so it's hard to picture.
I doubt driving around with the liftgate open has much to do with the top of the liftgate being twisted. First of all, virtually EVERY Nomad has this problem and I doubt that all of them did that. If you drive around with the liftgate open you get exhaust into the car too. Someone might put the liftgate up now and then but the torsion rods apply a load 24/7. The torsion rods are very stout, like the trunk lid rods on a HT or sedan. When the liftgate is down, that's when the highest loads are applied to it. The top of the liftgate is pretty small in cross sectional area.
I doubt any one has actually *measured* or calculated the loads on the liftgate in either the open, or UP position, so the above statement is an opinion. As CN states.. it's his *opinion* and we all know about opinions... :) I've driven with my liftgate up (and the tailgate down) carrying a 15x18 ft carpet roll home once long ago.. don't recall any fumes coming into the drivers compartment either... the windows were down, vents open.. all the air was moving from front to rear in the car. Other reasons for driving iwth the liftgate up was to COOL the car when no cars were *customized*, Vintage air didn't exist.. the only 'vintage air' was from the open vent windows! :) and the exhaust pipes on stock cars didn't come out the rear, they either exited at the rear corners of the car (point OUT), or behind the rear wheels. And to address the highest loads' statement... another opinion. IMO the highest loads on the liftgate itself would be when it was UP, only supported at the hinges and support arms - ie weight load, gravity, wind loads, etc. When the liftgate is UP, loading from the torsion rods is minimized, but all other loads are against the upper part of the frame (which is actually on the low side in this situation, supporting the glass weight, wind load, etc. When the liftgate is DOWN, it is being supported all around by the body of the car, and the tailgate, and only in the down position, I'd perhaps agree that the torsion rods are the largest contributor of load on the liftgate. This IS one possible reason .. maybe the major reason that the liftgates get torqued, but this is only opinion, unless someone has done some analysis or testing that I haven't seen.Quote:
Originally Posted by chevynut
I think you are quite confused on a couple of points.
First, it's pretty well known that trifives in general, and particularly wagons, generate a lot of negative airflow pressure at the rear of the vehicle. If you have an oil leak, or your engine burns/passes significant oil, it gets all over the trunk lid or tailgate. If the liftgate is open, exhaust gas gets sucked in.
Second, the highest force with the torsion bars is as/when the liftgate closes. I accept Chevynut's comments that it's not just about closing the liftgate, it's about the torsion bar forces anytime the liftgate is closed. Particularly when driving around with it closed, where it sees some road vibrations which flex everything. All this liftgate stuff is well documented and is no mystery.
Rick,
You need to re-read my post again with an open mind... :)
If the stock liftgate struts would bend the liftgate while driving around with it open, then the gas struts would do the same thing. But they don't as far as I know. I've never heard of anyone having the liftgate distort while driving with it open with gas struts, and I'm sure some guys drive around with it open....especially since it's impossible for exhaust to enter through it. :p It's the torsion rods twisting it 24/7 for years that does it. Ask Madmook.
It's the torsion rods that distort it. Definately...upgrade to struts while you're at it, or your looking to waste your money getting it straightened.
I contacted Jerry Cabunoc in Santa Ana. He still does them, both straightening and getting them chromed.
madmooks is doing liftgates again, I just sent mine out around three weeks ago. he doesn't do rechroming any more that I know of.
I'd be surprised if he doesn't do any more re-chroming. He's been chroming parts for a while now and liftgates were one of his specialties. If he's not doing them, who are you sending it to? Liftgates are rare and if one gets screwed up it's hard to replace. Mike's guy is pretty awesome and he really does a nice job. I had him do all my interior chrome trim and front smoothie bumper too. Ogden is doing my rear bumper.Quote:
Originally Posted by mech393
they have chroming shops in Wisconsin does chroming of auto parts, but mine was painted black so ill probably paint it black again. Since I retired my pockets aren't as deep as they once was, so I have to pick and choose how I spend my money.
sorry I should have also included that I talked to mike and he said he's not rechroming anymore .
Quote:
Originally Posted by mech393
That's too bad. I just assembled my door glass and the Nomad window frames I had him re-chrome look awesome. Most of my stuff is still wrapped in bubble pack but Mike inspects every piece himself and he's really picky, so I trust that he made sure they were as good as they can be. ;)
His website still says he does chrome work though...... http://madmooks.com/Chrome_Plating.html
I'm suspecting one reason Mike isn't getting the liftgates chromed any longer is perhaps the distance from his new place in AZ? to his old chrome shop?? Maybe Mike will butt in here and give us the straight scoop and total story??
If I read his posts correctly, he's not only not doing chrome but he's not straightening liftgates either. So that's probably a matter of his time available more than anything.
mike is doing liftgates, he has mine right now, if you would like to talk to him go to facebook he's on there a lot.
well mike messaged me that he's almost finished with my liftgate and he will be modifying my hinges so I should be getting it back soon.
here are a couple of pictures of mike working on my liftgate
I’m back to straightening the gates , but we stopped chroming them. I took a break from them earlier this year. We have about 10 or so right now. Hope everyone has a Merry Christmas