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Thread: Muncie vs the World

  1. #11
    Registered Member 55 Rescue Dog's Avatar
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    If you are trying to build a "silk purse out of a sows ear" of course weight doesn't matter. But, a portly car will never out accelerate, brake, or corner faster than a lighter one. It's like pulling a trailer behind a car when you add 1500 pounds for all the convenient gizmo's. I weigh 175 at 6'2, and a lighter driver would be faster. You really notice the weight difference in a kart, motorcycle, bicycle, walking/running, or even a horse. I don't know how I could possibly carry around even an extra 100 pounds every day. I know I could accelerate, turn, or stop faster, plus it would hurt more to fall down.
    Last edited by 55 Rescue Dog; 06-02-2019 at 05:43 PM.

  2. #12
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gmvette View Post
    A twenty to twenty five percent increase in tranny weight is substantial. The size of a Tremec TKO is about the same percentage over a Muncie.
    Yeah, but for 25% more weight you get 25% more gears too!! The T56 is a better deal because you get 50% more gears for only 35% more weight!

    It would just seem to me putting more power in to a street rod only to counter act it by making it overly heavy defeats the purpose. I like spirited driving as well as the next guy but weight is counter intuitive to that goal in MHO.
    It all depends on what comforts and conveniences you want. If you want PS, PB, PDL, PW, power seats, a big amp, 6 speakers, subwoofers, and A/C, you can't do it for nothing....they all add weight. Sure a lighter car will accelerate faster than a heavier car with the same HP/torque. So you either lighten the car up or increase power to improve performance....what are you willing to give up to do that? I don't understand what "overly heavy" is when you want all of those power things. All you need to do to counter them is add power if you want. My Nomad with the BBC and all that power stuff should have around 6.5-7 lb/HP and 5.5-6 lb/ft-lb of torque. That should move it along just fine.

    Newer heavy cars seem to handle and perform great. But think how much more enhanced they would be with less weight. Drive trains are not over all heavy, but anti crash structures and DOT dictates puts on the pounds.
    You can always buy a new car with the least options, and rip out the seats, A/C, stereo, and everything else that adds weight if you want a light car. That's basically what they did with the new Z/28 Camaro. It's all a tradeoff. And I'll bet the added options outweigh the DOT safety things on new cars.

    Bottom line is if you want a race car, build a race car. If you want a cruiser that performs well with all the comforts of a new car, build it that way. That's what I'm doing.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

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  3. #13
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 55 Rescue Dog View Post
    If you are trying to build a "silk purse out of a sows ear" of course weight doesn't matter. But, a portly car will never out accelerate, brake, or corner faster than a lighter one.
    Total BS. All you have to do is have a higher power to weight ratio, big brakes and tires, and a great suspension. My Nomad will easily out-accelerate a sedan with a 350, out brake one with stock brakes or a tiny disc brake kit, and corner better than one with a stock suspension. You say "never"? What horseshit. LMAO!
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  4. #14
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    A twenty to twenty five percent increase in tranny weight is substantial.
    Not really. The rule of thumb for the drag strip is 100 lb weight reduction = 0.1 sec et improvement. You won't notice unless you're running a strictly competitive class. It's just when you do that 5 or 10 times that it's noticeable.

  5. #15
    Registered Member 55 Rescue Dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chevynut View Post
    Total BS. All you have to do is have a higher power to weight ratio, big brakes and tires, and a great suspension. My Nomad will easily out-accelerate a sedan with a 350, out brake one with stock brakes or a tiny disc brake kit, and corner better than one with a stock suspension. You say "never"? What horseshit. LMAO!
    That's very interesting Anut. So if you take a C4 and make it a 1000 pounds heavier, put on smaller front tires than a C4, with a big motor perched on top, with the rear track narrowed, it will take a corner like a C4 Corvette? I've autcrossed my 13 cop Tahoe just last year, which is similar in size with same wheelbase as a tri5. I know how a heavy vehicle is reluctant to change directions. It did pretty good, but didn't need more power, handled good with all the computer controlled stability/ABS/traction,but most definitely needed less weight. Had new Goodyear cop tires too. As far as Muncie transmissions go, I know that would be more fun than the 4-speed auto I'll probably use on my 55 C4. You might give a little more thought into a roll cage with all the power you have.
    PS...that Tahoe at 5200 portly pounds, could easily spank almost any tri-5 in an autocross, down the road, and especially across the median, unless it was a stock try-5. Certified for 149mph, and 45 mph in reverse. One thing they did to these cop trucks, for some reason was to block out disabling the stability control which ruins all the fun in the snow. The only old Chevy I've seen in the snow forever, was a couple years ago, and that was a ratted out 58 Biscayne.
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    Last edited by 55 Rescue Dog; 06-03-2019 at 03:56 PM.

  6. #16
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    Rescue dog that is a neat Tahoe. Does it have 6.2 liter, 4WD? It looks lowered, what’s the wheel size? Looks like it could be part of Trump’s escort.

    It is a law of physics an object in motion tends to stay in motion. Cut that weight down and it is less pronounced. Try to change direction and the same law of physics still applies. Add in the friction as turning and you have a bigger fight against weight. Same applies an object at rest tends to stay at rest, increase weight and the force to over come goes up by multiplication factors. So simply adding power to a porky (weight wise) car as chevynut suggest does not equate to the same outcome.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick_L View Post
    Not really. The rule of thumb for the drag strip is 100 lb weight reduction = 0.1 sec et improvement. You won't notice unless you're running a strictly competitive class. It's just when you do that 5 or 10 times that it's noticeable.
    About the only thing in this thread I agree with because we proved it 35 years ago at Lawrence Drag strip with sand bags.

  8. #18
    Registered Member 55 Rescue Dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gmvette View Post
    Rescue dog that is a neat Tahoe. Does it have 6.2 liter, 4WD? It looks lowered, what’s the wheel size? Looks like it could be part of Trump’s escort.

    It is a law of physics an object in motion tends to stay in motion. Cut that weight down and it is less pronounced. Try to change direction and the same law of physics still applies. Add in the friction as turning and you have a bigger fight against weight. Same applies an object at rest tends to stay at rest, increase weight and the force to over come goes up by multiplication factors. So simply adding power to a porky (weight wise) car as chevynut suggest does not equate to the same outcome.
    It is 2WD PPV (police pursuit vehicle), the 4WD is an SSV. It has a 5.3 engine, 6 speed, 3.08 locking diff. They sit lower than a stock Tahoe. The Goodyear tires are a unique size 265/60-17 V-speed rated, and are still used on the new Tahoe. They are government priced at $1300 a set, plus installation which I did myself. I run Michelin x-ice winter tires on the stock cop wheels.
    At the Michigan state police car testing, I think the Tahoe could do 1G in a corner. Another fun thing with an ex-cop vehicle, is the left lane is always open, and you get to go first at the stop signs. I had a 90 9C1 Caprice ex-patrol car before which was much more fun to drive, probably because is was like 1400 pounds lighter, and it is the same wheelbase as a 55, Tahoe, Chevelle, GTO, 442, Impala SS, etc. I have had many of them, and loved them. The 96 Impala SS was the best GM ever built on that 116 inch platform, except that it swelled to a porky 4200 lbs. They stopped production after that to produce the even heavier trucks everyone wanted at the Arlington, Texas plant. Sad.
    Last edited by 55 Rescue Dog; 06-04-2019 at 03:42 PM.

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