PDA

View Full Version : Little Help please Bel Air Big Block install questions



Robert Haas
07-09-2020, 01:31 PM
Installing a Mark V 454 in the 55, what oil pan and engine mounts should I be using?

Stock Steering in car and upgrading to the CPP power steering box, what headers can I squeeze in there that have 2" primaries?

Rick_L
07-09-2020, 05:24 PM
There are several ways to do this. The best one IMO is to use the Earle Williams engine mounts and place the engine 3/4" forward of stock. Earle Williams has a good set of headers too, but they are pricey. They will clear a power steering box.

With the 3/4" forward mounts, you will have to slightly modify the firewall for clearance for the valve covers. Stock location mounts, you have to modify a lot more. There's also mounts that put the engine further forward, but you'll have oil pan clearance problems and it will get crowded in the radiator area. Any BBC swap will need the radiator in front of the radiator support.

Milodon makes a Mark V/Mark VI pan that will clear the steering link. Sorry I don't have the part number.

Robert Haas
07-09-2020, 06:01 PM
Thank You Rick, I did order the Milodon pan, Pricey but I have used their stuff in the past, it has always been top shelf.

I will call Earls shop in the morning and ask about the mounts and the headers.

Due to the fact I am using Brodix heads, and will need a tad mo0re height then the stock valve covers I hope I can find some information on what exactly I will need to do to the firewall.

Rick_L
07-09-2020, 06:38 PM
Earle does offer some pieces and parts for modifying the firewall, but they are not necessary. They are as much for smoothing the firewall as they are for fit. Best way to figure out what needs to happen is to get the engine mounts and oil pan and do a trial assembly, marking where you need clearance. A little work with a BFH will fix you up. Tall valve covers just mean you may have to move the hammer work higher up. The amount of work needed is not huge, you do not need to cut anything.

Whozmad
07-10-2020, 09:39 PM
My two cents,
Rick L is spot on! I put a 1969 454 in my 55 Nomad. Stock steering and pan for now. Earle W. headers are a great fit, Just clears the ps box. Hooker headers did not! My motor mounts moved the beast 3/4” forward. Yes, a bfh did the rest.

markm
07-11-2020, 06:51 AM
I went 2.25 forward and left my BFH in toolbox. If you could find them 1.5 would work.

markm
07-11-2020, 06:54 AM
My two cents,
Rick L is spot on! I put a 1969 454 in my 55 Nomad. Stock steering and pan for now. Earle W. headers are a great fit, Just clears the ps box. Hooker headers did not! My motor mounts moved the beast 3/4” forward. Yes, a bfh did the rest.

Are you sure about that year.

Robert Haas
07-11-2020, 08:43 AM
My two cents,
Rick L is spot on! I put a 1969 454 in my 55 Nomad. Stock steering and pan for now. Earle W. headers are a great fit, Just clears the ps box. Hooker headers did not! My motor mounts moved the beast 3/4” forward. Yes, a bfh did the rest.
As far as I know, no such thing as a 69 454. It was introduced in 1970.

Earl called me back and is building me a set of coated headers. ( I use V bands on my builds and never use the 3 bolt flange style mounts) He is also sending me his motor mounts, and a firewall patch kit I can cut and weld in to clear the valve covers. He gave me a part number for a Milidon oil pan and pick up that I ordered from Summit.

markm
07-11-2020, 08:52 AM
I too believe 1970 was first year of 454. Moroso also makes pans for swap, I have three of them.

BamaNomad
07-11-2020, 08:58 AM
The 1970 model year was the First models to put the 454 ci engine (Chevelles mainly).. but those began being produced in the Fall of '69, and some of the engines were likely cast/assembled in summer of 1969, and the DATES on those blocks would be dated in the 1969 calendar year! So all you guys are right, and perhaps WHOZMAD is also, since if he had one of the early engines.. separated from the car it would not be necessary to identify what model car it came from... just the cast date ... :)

PS. (Stirring the crap a little... :) ... the best use of those heavy BB's is as boat anchors!~ :) :)

markm
07-11-2020, 09:11 AM
Keeping the crap flowing, you would not have said that here 6 months ago.:)

jims56
07-11-2020, 12:18 PM
Keeping the crap flowing, you would not have said that here 6 months ago.:)

Isn't it great you can now.:)

Robert Haas
07-11-2020, 02:18 PM
4 hours of work today netted this


1095610957109581095910960

Chevy Chase
07-11-2020, 02:39 PM
Like the extension you made for the cherry picker. The "C" clamp was a good idea to avoid a mishap on the way up. How was it on the way down? On my next to do list.

jims56
07-11-2020, 09:38 PM
I see building a sleeper.

Robert Haas
07-12-2020, 01:42 PM
10972

10973

I sure will have a lot of very nice parts for anyone looking for stock original stuff. Hope I can find a deserving sole building a stocker that needs any of this stuff, I don't want a dime for it, just want to see it go to a person that needs it.

Robert Haas
07-16-2020, 11:01 AM
Built a dolly that indexes under the cross member that holds the vehicle at exactly finished ride height. Used premium ball bearing casters that won't kill the paint on my shop floor and lets me push the vehicle around solo.


10999
11000
11001

Slim57
07-16-2020, 02:19 PM
Going to be interesting ride! Interested to see how the motor placement works out.

Wish in some way I was doing '55 to negate a potential off our stash. Parents "57 was stolen few years back. What we got back was stripped shell mostly...

Looking forward to seeing progress on this project.

Robert Haas
07-17-2020, 12:24 PM
I want to do a proper build here but will not be splitting the chassis from the body, not at this time anyway. So I am having the front frame rails and firewall, trans tunnel blasted to bare metal.



11011
11012
11013
11014
11015
11016

NickP
07-17-2020, 03:18 PM
Robert I think your attachment links are broken. Nice build.

Robert Haas
07-17-2020, 04:50 PM
Robert I think your attachment links are broken. Nice build.

Thank you, I fixed the links

Robert Haas
07-19-2020, 06:20 AM
Something exciting is happening

11041

BamaNomad
07-19-2020, 06:59 AM
Maybe a little primer/paint on the front frame members and firewall? :) Are you going to repaint the firewall in the original 'coral color'? or ?? Personally I LIKE the body color carried down the firewall... :)

Robert Haas
07-19-2020, 12:13 PM
Maybe a little primer/paint on the front frame members and firewall? :) Are you going to repaint the firewall in the original 'coral color'? or ?? Personally I LIKE the body color carried down the firewall... :)

yes coral on the firewall, gloss black on the frame, satin black on the core support and inner fenders.

Robert Haas
07-19-2020, 12:16 PM
11043110441104511045110461104711048

well?

BamaNomad
07-19-2020, 03:49 PM
Very nice Robert... The frame paint came out exactly as you -planned it... ! :)

Robert Haas
07-20-2020, 05:25 PM
11057

Slim57
07-20-2020, 06:31 PM
Looking good Robert. Planning mine to be all satin black (frame and engine compartment). Looking forward to see the contrast. Should be subtle but clean.

bigblock
07-21-2020, 07:07 AM
Robert did you spray that outside? I was thinking of doing that when it comes time.

Robert Haas
07-21-2020, 09:25 AM
Robert did you spray that outside? I was thinking of doing that when it comes time.


Yes, first thing in the morning before the breeze kicks up. wet the ground and get to it.

we started at 5 in the morning and had it tucked away in the shop by noon

Robert Haas
07-21-2020, 06:21 PM
Gotta get the firewall ready for the big block. No BFH for me. What fun would that be?

Passenger side first.

11059
11060
11061
11062
11063
11064
11065
11066
11067

Robert Haas
07-23-2020, 12:30 PM
110771107811079110801108111082110831108411085

markm
07-23-2020, 04:19 PM
How does that effect the heater box fit and function.

Robert Haas
07-23-2020, 05:03 PM
How does that effect the heater box fit and function.

Will be running a Vintage Air unit, that clears perfectly. However the stock heater had a good amount of clearance so I suspect it would have been fine.

Robert Haas
07-23-2020, 05:13 PM
11115

11116

markm
07-23-2020, 05:33 PM
I was worried that such mods would create havoc with stock heater etc. As a result I went 2.25 forward. I could have got by with 1.5, but no less.

BamaNomad
07-23-2020, 06:29 PM
Looks good Robert... Does that mean you're staying with the coral / gray on the car color? :) *GOOD*.. :)

markm
07-24-2020, 09:22 AM
I really like what you did, however I don't think it would have worked out on my 55. Why I have a Weiand Tunnel Ram with 2x4 Holley 600s and carb and breather clearance up high is tight.

BamaNomad
07-24-2020, 11:28 AM
I really like what you did, however I don't think it would have worked out on my 55. Why I have a Weiand Tunnel Ram with 2x4 Holley 600s and carb and breather clearance up high is tight.

Tight up high? :) is the sky low where you are Mark? :) (ie. the Weiand Tunnel Ram pokes THRU the hood doesn't it? :) .. all that is above that is SKY?).. :)

markm
07-24-2020, 12:10 PM
Not even close, stock hood shuts without carbs. With carbs and air cleaners only a couple inches protrude into scoop. You obviously have not seen those pictures of the TLB car with fake carb mounted in scoop for camera shots from inside car.

Robert Haas
07-24-2020, 05:48 PM
Looks good Robert... Does that mean you're staying with the coral / gray on the car color? :) *GOOD*.. :)

yes sir

Robert Haas
07-25-2020, 05:27 PM
11126

Saturday was a good day

markm
07-25-2020, 05:28 PM
Not even close, stock hood shuts without carbs. With carbs and air cleaners only a couple inches protrude into scoop. You obviously have not seen those pictures of the TLB car with fake carb mounted in scoop for camera shots from inside car.

Really hoped one of you tech savey guys would have found a picture of this and posted it.

Robert Haas
07-27-2020, 06:33 AM
Sunday was a funday. Hanging the sheet metal. really gave me a sense of where I am on this build. I am very happy with what I have accomplished in three weekends and a few nights after work.

1113111132111331113411135111361113711138

BamaNomad
07-27-2020, 07:11 AM
Robert! You've made some fantastic progress the past few weeks... and Yes, it IS fun when it all 'works'... :)

Belair-o
07-28-2020, 05:11 AM
Robert,
Wonderful progress, and it all looks gorgeous!
Regards, Doug

Robert Haas
07-28-2020, 04:38 PM
This delivery is getting me all weak in the knees.

a pallet full of goodness.

1115211153

markm
07-28-2020, 04:53 PM
Very nice looking build and very impressed with the speed which you have done it.

Robert Haas
08-04-2020, 05:08 PM
The Earl Williams headers and firewall notch kit along with his motor mounts sure make the Big Block settle right in like it belongs there.

111861118711188

BamaNomad
08-04-2020, 07:44 PM
That sure looks like a LOT OF MOTOR Robert!... :) and it does look like it's made for it's location... :)

454bbcman
08-05-2020, 08:56 AM
The 1970 model year was the First models to put the 454 ci engine (Chevelles mainly).. but those began being produced in the Fall of '69, and some of the engines were likely cast/assembled in summer of 1969, and the DATES on those blocks would be dated in the 1969 calendar year! So all you guys are right, and perhaps WHOZMAD is also, since if he had one of the early engines.. separated from the car it would not be necessary to identify what model car it came from... just the cast date ... :)

PS. (Stirring the crap a little... :) ... the best use of those heavy BB's is as boat anchors!~ :) :)

OUCH Bama, you really know how to hurt a guy! You have to admit when keeping it old school the BBC did the job on the big end! :D :)

Robert Haas
08-06-2020, 06:22 AM
I have lusted for one of these for years.


11192
1119311194
11195

Rick_L
08-06-2020, 11:45 AM
Robert, is your engine and transmission assembled for good?

I just noticed a problem I saw with a buddy's car, the engine oil pan drain plug can't be removed with the bellhousing in place. You'll want to fix that some way.

567chevys
08-06-2020, 12:19 PM
Robert, is your engine and transmission assembled for good?

I just noticed a problem I saw with a buddy's car, the engine oil pan drain plug can't be removed with the bellhousing in place. You'll want to fix that some way.

Good Eye Rick

Sid

Robert Haas
08-07-2020, 05:32 PM
Yea I picked up on that. No nothing is in permanently being that engine in these pictures is made out of plastic. So yea, I will be notching the scatter shield.

I am building the exhaust right now and it is going to be very cool. 3" 304 polished Stainless all the way to the bumper with the Flowmaster super 50's. I built my own x pipe and will start hanging the system tomorrow.

11198

markm
08-08-2020, 01:26 PM
Notch the Scatershield bye bye SFI rating the NHRA is a bunch of assholes.

55 Rescue Dog
08-08-2020, 03:33 PM
Best solution would be to relocate the drain plug for sure, and refinish pan as needed. I hate horizontal drain plugs so many engines use. You have to guess where it is going to go when you pull the plug.

Robert Haas
08-09-2020, 10:31 AM
Notch the Scatershield bye bye SFI rating the NHRA is a bunch of assholes.

I really do not want to deal with refinishing the cadmium like coating on that pan. The closest this car will be to a drag strip is the parking lot.

Robert Haas
08-09-2020, 10:32 AM
Best solution would be to relocate the drain plug for sure, and refinish pan as needed. I hate horizontal drain plugs so many engines use. You have to guess where it is going to go when you pull the plug.

I have knocked the drain plug out of a pan that hung about as low as this one. These smoothy bottoms tend to be a tad more forgiving.