Seat belt issues

[chevynut]

When I built my car I bought a set of front 3-point seatbelts from Julianos and made them fit the car. I mounted the retractor inside the quarter panel and the loop near the middle of the b-pillar, anchored by a bolt. This is what they looked like installed.



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I have been trying to get another pair ordered in charcoal, but I've run into a dilemma of sorts. There are five different kinds of latches but I'm only interested in the side button release type and the end button release.

One problem I've run into is that I can only find ONE supplier that has color-matched plastic to match the charcoal webbing. The other two I've found either offer no charcoal webbing, or the plastic is black, which would work but not preferred. Also, Juliano's seatbelts now have an ugly long bracket at the anchor end instead of the small ltriangular shaped one like on my seatbelts.

I installed one of the seatbelts in the pics above on the passenger side and it won't wind up all the way. It needs to be around a foot shorter when fully retracted to make the belt tight against the side panel, because the spool is full with around 60" of belt un-wound. Mine needs to be around 48" of webbing fully retracted. Most 3-point belts come 133" long but I haven't determined how long mine needs to be when extended. I need to do that.

The other problem is that the latch on this type of belt doesn't slide freely on the webbing. So when you're in the seat and latch the belt, you have to pull the webbing through the latch. Then when you remove the seatbelt, the latch prevents the webbing from winding up on the retractor spool, and you end up with loose webbing hanging on the floor. New cars have free sliding latches with a button or sewn stop to locate the latch.

The solution is shorter length of webbing (not offered by the supplier) and a freely sliding latch. Both my trucks and all of our cars have free-sliding latches and end release buckles. You can't mix and match latches and buckles with the different types.

Next problem is the end release buckles are only available with cables on them, no sheath. That might look kinda stupid with a buckle hanging out there on the end of the cable. I found another supplier that has end release buckle sheaths, but only in black. I could possibly paint/dye it dark gray if it didn't match closely enough. Maybe all black plastic would make more sense but I didn't want to add yet another color to the interior.

Have any of you installed 3-point belts in your cars? If so, how did you address the sliding latch problem?

[chevynut]

Here's the different latches and buckles.....

End release


https://www.seatbeltsplus.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/WSCH14134C-3-Point-Retractable-Seat-Belt-End-Release-Button-12-Inch-Cable-Black.jpg
Side button release (3 different buttons offered)


https://www.seatbeltsplus.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/WSCH201P-3-POINT-RETRACTABLE-SEAT-BELT-CHARCOAL-6009.jpg

[chevynut]

In looking at these pics again it just occurred to me that my old seatbelts have a different latch than the new ones I'm looking at. It's much more square. So perhaps the new type do slide freely on the webbing instead of having to pull it through. I'm going to call tomorrow to find out. If it does, that's one problem resolved. I'm also going to see if they can offer a shorter webbing retracted length. I think they build all of these to order so maybe they can.

Here's the latch on my existing belts....

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here's a free-sliding latch:

https://www.seatbeltsplus.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/AC12-3-Pt-Dual-Sensitive-Retractable-Seat-Belt-12-Inch-Cable-End4.jpg

[Custer55]

I got seat belts for my son's 59 Mercury from a different supplier but I can't think of their name off hand. Not sure if theirs would address all of your issues but I do remember they had different buckle styles and lengths for smaller cars like street rods. If I can find their website I will post it. I think they might be in CA.

[Custer55]

www.wescoperformance.com/
Wesco Performance is the place, They sell seat belts for about anything you can think of.
Hope it helps.

[chevynut]

www.wescoperformance.com/ (http://www.wescoperformance.com/)
Wesco Performance is the place, They sell seat belts for about anything you can think of.
Hope it helps.

Thanks for mentioning them. I had looked at them before but for some reason didn't like what they had available. I just looked again, and they have 30 colors and all components supposedly match with their standard colors, which charcoal is one of them. They also have shorter webbing, at 125" or 120". I need to know if the latch slides freely on the webbing so I'll call and ask. Hope it works out...thanks again!

[WagonCrazy]

The Julianos 3 pt belts I put in my Nomad do NOT slide freely (as you are mentioning). So when you release the belt latch, it winds up to the point of the upper latch hanging up on the b pillar mount. So there is slack to deal with. I have to reach up and manually adjust that upper latch on the belt to remove the slack. Not the best solution...

And as far as the short cable on the buckle end, consider having your upholstery guys make up a leather sleeve to slide over it.

[Belair-o]

Chevynut,
Thanks for discussing your seatbelt issues. I have the same issue (and as described by WagonCrazy). I have to hand wind the slack seatbelt onto the tensioner, so it is ready to stop me in an accident (too long a belt on too small a tensioner). Your post reminds me to also do some looking to see if there is a different belt setup that would eliminate the issue.
Thanks, Doug

[chevynut]

Paul mand Doug, that's exactly the issue I'm trying to avoid. I almost ordered new belts until I re-installed my old ones and recognized the problem. Actually, I first noticed that they were too long retracted. The driver's side (shown in the pics above) has a little shorter length of belt when retracted. I think 133" is too long for these belts. I didn't mount my upper loop as high on the b-pillar as sone do, because I wanted to keep the belt behind the door when retracted.

As far as I can tell virtually all new vehicles have a free-sliding latch. Both my trucks, and both of our Infinitis have them. I wonder why these seatbelt companies don't make that standard on their seatbelts. If I can't get a free-sliding one I'm going to just buy a set of belts and disassemble them and replace the latch as long as it works in the buckle. I've searched and can't find a charcoal sliding latch, but both my trucks have that color. Then you have to put some kind of button or stopper on the belt to keep the latch from falling to the ground, but at least it will stow right.

Here's the button I'm talking about....

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71ts0uPhwRL._AC_SL1060_.jpg

[chevynut]

These belts aren't that hard to take apart. I had to flip mine around because the retractor is sitting the opposite way as the latch. All you do is upen the cover on the retractor, pull all the webbing out, push the webbing through the slot, remove the retainer pin, and pull the webbing through the slot. Just don't let the spool go or you'll unwind the retractor and you'll have a mess.

If I have to, I'll cut the webbing to get the new sliding latch on, then I'll have Larry sew the loop back together for the pin. Once there's a couple of winds of webbing over it, it will be safe.

I'm going to install my seat today and use a rope to measure exactly how long of a belt I need.

[chevynut]

I have the same issue (and as described by WagonCrazy). I have to hand wind the slack seatbelt onto the tensioner, so it is ready to stop me in an accident (too long a belt on too small a tensioner). Your post reminds me to also do some looking to see if there is a different belt setup that would eliminate the issue.
Thanks, Doug

There is probably too long of a belt and the retractor can't wind it all onto the spool because it's filled up. That's how mine is. With the spool completely full, I have about 57" of webbing hanging out of the retractor on one belt, and 55" or so on the other belt. And with the seatbelt around your body and latched, you probably have quite a bit more belt that you can pull out, right? I'd try to find someone to shorten the webbing if I were you. It's probably cheaper than new belts.

[55 Rescue Dog]

Why couldn't you find seatbelts that you like out of OEM "modern car" and use something like that instead of aftermarket which are probably not as good anyway?

[55 Rescue Dog]

Paul mand Doug, that's exactly the issue I'm trying to avoid. I almost ordered new belts until I re-installed my old ones and recognized the problem. Actually, I first noticed that they were too long retracted. The driver's side (shown in the pics above) has a little shorter length of belt when retracted. I think 133" is too long for these belts. I didn't mount my upper loop as high on the b-pillar as sone do, because I wanted to keep the belt behind the door when retracted.

As far as I can tell virtually all new vehicles have a free-sliding latch. Both my trucks, and both of our Infinitis have them. I wonder why these seatbelt companies don't make that standard on their seatbelts. If I can't get a free-sliding one I'm going to just buy a set of belts and disassemble them and replace the latch as long as it works in the buckle. I've searched and can't find a charcoal sliding latch, but both my trucks have that color. Then you have to put some kind of button or stopper on the belt to keep the latch from falling to the ground, but at least it will stow right.

Here's the button I'm talking about....

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71ts0uPhwRL._AC_SL1060_.jpg
That stop button is a Dorman part available at most autopart's stores in stock, in black. I just recently bought a pair to replace one that was missing in my truck after I was tired of picking the buckle up off the floor.

[chevynut]

I just measured my seatbelt length and I need 105" from bolt to bolt to fit me where the seat sits for me while driving. That means from where the retractor bolt is to where the opposite anchor bolt is. I measured the seatbelts I have and they're 136" bolt to bolt, and 133" from retractor face to the opposite anchor bolt. So they must refer to the length of the webbing outside of the retractor when specifying length. So I'd really need 102" seat belts the way they measure them.

I need a maximum of 50" of webbing out of the retractor when fully retracted. Since there's about 57" sticking out now, I figure the retractor can only hold about 76" of webbing on the spool.

If I order the 125" belts they would have about 23" still spooled when latched for extra slack and 49" left when fully retracted which could be a problem. With the 120" belts I'd still have 18" of extra belt while buckled, and there would only be 44" left outside the retractor with the spool full. The 120" belts sound like the best fit for my application.

[chevynut]

Why couldn't you find seatbelts that you like out of OEM "modern car" and use something like that instead of aftermarket which are probably not as good anyway?

Tell me what "modern car" has the exact belts I need and I'll think about it. As far as "not as good", it's likely they use the same manufacturers for the webbing, and I believe the retractors are the same or similar. The main difference is in the trim pieces.

[55 Rescue Dog]

IDK I guess, but you mentioned 4 vehicles that you owned that you liked the factory seatbelts in. I tried to make mine better for holding me strapped to the seat with 5-point belts anchored to the rollbar, and don't have to deal with retractors which isn't a big deal to me. I can stuff them out of sight if needed for show, and they are pretty easy to put on. I feel like part of the car when I have these snugged up.
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[chevynut]

IDK I guess, but you mentioned 4 vehicles that you owned that you liked the factory seatbelts in. I tried to make mine better for holding me strapped to the seat with 5-point belts anchored to the rollbar, and don't have to deal with retractors which isn't a big deal to me. I can stuff them out of sight if needed for show, and they are pretty easy to put on. I feel like part of the car when I have these snugged up.


Honestly, RD, this isn't about your car or any race car. Those seatbelts in my car would look stupid to me.

Just because I like the way the seatbelts are configured on my 4 other cars doesn't mean ANY of them will work in my Nomad. Maybe you just don't understand the issues, and that's fine. Just don't keep posting irrelevant obtuse stuff that doesn't help. I'm not talking about any 5-point seatbelts.

[Belair-o]

There is probably too long of a belt and the retractor can't wind it all onto the spool because it's filled up. That's how mine is. With the spool completely full, I have about 57" of webbing hanging out of the retractor on one belt, and 55" or so on the other belt. And with the seatbelt around your body and latched, you probably have quite a bit more belt that you can pull out, right? I'd try to find someone to shorten the webbing if I were you. It's probably cheaper than new belts.

Chevynut,
I think you are right. I will pursue shortening the seat belts (that already match the interior color & style of my car), rather than hunting for a unicorn.
Thanks, Doug

[55 Rescue Dog]

As long as the subject is about seatbelts, which people might be looking at the thread for ideas, what's wrong with tossing an alternative idea into the mix for something different, or maybe better? Sorry

[BamaNomad]

RD: CN was not asking a 'generic question' about seat belts; he had a specific question which your response totally ignored. Please don't do that ... :)

[chevynut]

As long as the subject is about seatbelts, which people might be looking at the thread for ideas, what's wrong with tossing an alternative idea into the mix for something different, or maybe better? Sorry

Well RD, why don't you start a post about your LS engine and ask a few questions you want feedback on, and I'll tell you a few things about my John Deere riding mower engine and maybe show you a picture of my 502. That's typical of what you usually do. It's really annoying.

[chevynut]

It looks like Wesco Performance (thanks Brian!!) has the best choice of seatbelts for my needs. They have a "convertible/hardtop" seatbelt that's 120" long and I can get end release buckles and all color-matched plastic except for the lower anchor bolt cover. At least that's what I interpret from their website. Julianos has those lower bolt covers and I've ordered a pair. So the only remaining issue is the lack of a sliding latch.....I hope.

https://www.wescoperformance.com/convertilble-seat-belt-eb.html#_ga=2.81378069.327714529.1678814262-1763409070.1678667243

I measured my car again, and with the latch where it needs to be to meet the buckle with the seatbelt around me, when it retracts and the latch hits the upper anchor loop, there's 12" or so of slack webbing laying on the floor. This is unacceptable to me and I don't understand how people get around this without a sliding latch. You would think that over 20+ years of selling seatbelts they'd figure this out.

So my plan is to try to find some charcoal sliding latches that fit the end release buckle and replace the ones on the seatbelts, if I can't figure out another way to make them slide. I contacted Seatbeltsplus yesterday and they told me the latches, which look identical to the ones at Wesco, don't slide freely. That's really stupid imo. I'm sure they slide when you don't want them to. :D

Just more modifications to do.....as usual. :(

https://sep.turbifycdn.com/ay/wescoperformance/end-button-release-3-point-retractable-seat-belt-for-convertibles-or-hardtops-9.jpg

[Aussienomad]

CN
Re the belts not retracting properly.
I suspect you have "normal" belts which the industry terms "90 degree" belts, where the retratctor and upper mounts are in line. When you mount the retractor away from that line you need a different belt - I found that out when I went through the ordering process down here - my belts are positioned similarly to yours. An old mate was boss at a local seat belt company (Hemco) at the time and he explained that I needed "110 degree" belts to compensate for moving the retractor. I explained that I wanted the retractors inside the quarters (like yours) and he answered that they simply reverse them - like you have now done, and he set me up with the 100 degree belts - I now have them in all my Nomads.

I suggest you talk with the providers there and discuss with them about the 90 v 110 belts and see what they say.

Cheers, Des

I have been trying to upload a pic of mine - cant do so for some reason.

[chevynut]

CN
Re the belts not retracting properly.
I suspect you have "normal" belts which the industry terms "90 degree" belts, where the retratctor and upper mounts are in line. When you mount the retractor away from that line you need a different belt - I found that out when I went through the ordering process down here - my belts are positioned similarly to yours. An old mate was boss at a local seat belt company (Hemco) at the time and he explained that I needed "110 degree" belts to compensate for moving the retractor. I explained that I wanted the retractors inside the quarters (like yours) and he answered that they simply reverse them - like you have now done, and he set me up with the 100 degree belts - I now have them in all my Nomads.

I suggest you talk with the providers there and discuss with them about the 90 v 110 belts and see what they say.

Cheers, Des

I have been trying to upload a pic of mine - cant do so for some reason.

I've never heard about 110 degree belts. I read about "dual sensitive" belts but I don't really understand how they differ. I THINK it means they lock on both vehicle deceleration and fast webbing movement. My webbing comes out of the retractor straight, not at an angle. The retractor is mounted at an angle in the quarter panel.

It's pretty clear that my problem is the retractor won't hold any more webbing. The retractor works fine until the spool is full. I'm not measuring this in the car, rather laying on the floor and I know the spool is completely full with 57" still remaining. I also measured the belt fully extended and it's 133". My retractor is not mounted at the floor level, but about halfway up the quarter panel where you see the bolt coming through. That requires that the belt is shorter than if it was mounted on the floor. Floor to shoulder loop is 29" and shoulder loop to retractor bolt is 21".

The other problem relates to the latch not sliding for proper stowage on the b-pillar. The latch hits the shoulder loop with a foot too much belt left below it.

I ordered the Wesco belts last night and I think they're the closest to what I need. I'll have to deal with the sliding latch issue somehow.

I'd like to see how you did yours and made it work. Do you have sliding latches? How long is your belt?

[55 Rescue Dog]

I can see how the non-sliding buckle could be a benefit over the sliding buckle and might even like it better after you get used to it. The lap belt can be sinched up snug and keep you there, and the shoulder belt still could do its thing. Just slide the buckle up when you take it off and will be easier to put back on with some slack, then give it tug and go. If nobody is around to look at your car you could even just let it hang down quite often.
All modern cars have pre-tensioners on the seatbelts to tighten up the slack, which might be a reason for sliding buckles to snug the belts during a crash.

[Aussienomad]

I'd like to see how you did yours and made it work. Do you have sliding latches? How long is your belt?

For some reason I can't upload pics. I'm using the icon here to "insert image" but it won't work.

[BamaNomad]

For some reason I can't upload pics. I'm using the icon here to "insert image" but it won't work.

Perhaps your image file is too large, Des? Try a smaller image, one at a time and see what happens?

[chevynut]

I can see how the non-sliding buckle could be a benefit over the sliding buckle and might even like it better after you get used to it. The lap belt can be sinched up snug and keep you there, and the shoulder belt still could do its thing. Just slide the buckle up when you take it off and will be easier to put back on with some slack, then give it tug and go. If nobody is around to look at your car you could even just let it hang down quite often.
All modern cars have pre-tensioners on the seatbelts to tighten up the slack, which might be a reason for sliding buckles to snug the belts during a crash.

You clearly don't understand the problem.

I see no benefit of a non-sliding latch over a free-sliding one. The non-free-sliding latch also slides, it just doesn't slide freely. The free-sliding latch allows you to put the latch wherever you want it to sit, and it goes there anytime you take the belt off. You would have to re-position the non-sliding latch every time you took it off so the seatbelt wouldn't lay on the floor. That might be okay with you, but it's not for me. These seatbelt manufacturers need to get up to date.

Modern cars have retractors, just like these seatbelts I bought and all other retractable ones on the market. They keep the belt snug and rolled up no matter where it is. The only lock when there's sudden tension on the belt. The sliding latch allows the belt to stow in the rolled up snug condition, against the side of the car. Just like it allows it to sit on my Silverado seat nice and snug and with the latch in a convenient location.



https://www.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/2/2018/06/project-over-under-2003-chevy-silverado-part-3-25.jpg?fit=around%7C875:492

[55 Rescue Dog]

Should just put those seats in it, and then the belts would work great. I considered that design at one point, and you could just modify the shoulder belt pivot a little lower for looks. It would be too simple of an idea for you though.

[Aussienomad]

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[Aussienomad]

Managed to reduce the size, get it into my albums and went from there.
There must be an easier way to post pics on here.

[BamaNomad]

I've tried several ways of posting photos here, but all seem a bit cumbersome to me...

[chevynut]

Should just put those seats in it, and then the belts would work great. I considered that design at one point, and you could just modify the shoulder belt pivot a little lower for looks. It would be too simple of an idea for you though.

You're such a simple-minded clown. I don't want truck seats in my car and I already have the seats I want to use. Your solution is just to slap something in no matter how stupid it looks. Why don't you just put me on ignore and stop your inane comments in my threads. You are of no help to anyone.

[chevynut]

Des, it looks like your belt isn't retracting all the way either so I wonder if it's too long. At least you have the sliding latch that doesn't restrict it. I wonder if you have the so-called "dual sensitive" belts. I've only seen them one place and that's Seatbeltsplus, and they're only available in all black. How do you plan to finish the headliner in that seat belt area? I have an idea that I discussed with my interior guy and he thinks it will work.

[BamaNomad]

I've tried several ways of posting photos here, but all seem a bit cumbersome to me...

A great change here would be a simple method of 'copy and paste'.. copy an image and be able to 'paste' it into a posting...

[chevynut]

A great change here would be a simple method of 'copy and paste'.. copy an image and be able to 'paste' it into a posting...

You can copy and paste pics from any website and I have done it many times (I did it on the seats above). You can't do that if the pic is only on your computer or phone. I have no problem uploading pics from my computer, as long as the image is under about 1.5MB.

[Aussienomad]

CN
That pic was a while back. We'e trimmed the garnish mold a bit to allow for belt clearance, and the trimmer will finish the fit, so will leave to him.
Here's a pic of how we trimmed the garnish mold in the 56 - seat belts mounted the same way.
Cheers, Des

[chevynut]

CN
That pic was a while back. We'e trimmed the garnish mold a bit to allow for belt clearance, and the trimmer will finish the fit, so will leave to him.
Here's a pic of how we trimmed the garnish mold in the 56 - seat belts mounted the same way.
Cheers, Des

Looks good Des. I'm planning on trying to cover the seatbelt below the shoulder loop. I'm not sure how that affects the interior beltline molding. Maybe it won't work.

[Aussienomad]

Positive you'll have to trim the beltline molding a bit to allow the belt to exit from the quarter panel. Either a piece trimmed out like I've done, or maybe a small section of the molding flared - something like a louver - may lead into the cover you mentioned.

[Rick_L]

I measured my car again, and with the latch where it needs to be to meet the buckle with the seatbelt around me, when it retracts and the latch hits the upper anchor loop, there's 12" or so of slack webbing laying on the floor. This is unacceptable to me and I don't understand how people get around this without a sliding latch. You would think that over 20+ years of selling seatbelts they'd figure this out.


Curious if I'll have the same problem with the Julianos belts on my sedan, looks like I would.

Every late model I've had or ridden in, at least that I recall, has the sliding latch. It's second nature to deal with it when entering or exiting the vehicle. Those belts also have a stop on them for the latch that puts it in a convenient spot to grab it when putting the belt on. On a GM car/truck the stop is a plastic button that goes through the webbing.

[chevynut]

I got my new seatbelts from Wesco Performance. I'm not 100% happy with them but I think they're the best I'm going to get. The retractors are a different design than the ones from Julianos, and are larger. I think they'll be fine though. I sent a note on the order that if the end release buckle and the sheath didn't match the rest of the plastic, they needed to call me to discuss it. I never heard a word from them.

The issue is that they claim all the plastic matches in color, for their standard colors which include charcoal. The buckle end release is black, not charcoal, as is the sheath for it. It's going to be kinda hidden so maybe it won't be so obvious, but it's frustrating anyhow since they claimed everything matched. The rest of the parts are all "charcoal", but different shades. The bolt covers I got from Julianos are the lightest and match the webbing pretty good. The shoulder bolt cover is darkest and doesn't quite match the latch. These are supposed to be industry standard colors. The retractor color is irrelevant because they're hidden.

Anyhow, the latch is REALLY hard to move up and down the webbing. This is such a shitty design. I need to find some sliding latches and get rid of these stupid things. I sure wish these belt manufacturers would catch up with the 21st century.

Now I'm hoping these belt retractors are as easy to take apart as the Julianos ones are. I may have to have Larry do some sewing on them. :(

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[chevynut]

I looked at the seat belts a little more today and it looks like I have about 36" of belt hanging out of the retractor, which is about perfect so they will retract all the way. The belt comes out of the retractor about the same way as the Julianos belts, but instead of a steel pin it's plastic. I also found out that my Silverado sliding latch tongue is too wide to fit into the end release buckle, but my 2019 Sierra sliding latch fits. I always wonder why they have to change this stuff year after year.

Here's some pics of the retractor with the cover removed....

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Here's one thing I don't like about these belts. If you use their standard latch, it's so thick that it makes it hard to unlatch the belt. In fact, I think it's harder than a side release button. What are these people thinking? I have to find a pair of sliding latches somewhere. I think everything else is fine.

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[chevynut]

I think I finally solved the sliding latch problem. I found out that there are two widths of latches, 22mm and 25mm. Not sure why, but that's the way it is. Turns out the seatbelt latches in my 2003 Silverado don't work with the new end release buckles because they're 25mm wide. But the ones in my 2019 Sierra work perfectly and are the right color for my charcoal belts. I was looking for some latches for that model of truck, and they are "unobtainable" separately, and the belts are ~$150 each. Nobody sells just the latches as far as I can tell.

So in searching for the right color and vintage seatbelts, I ran across some 2017 Camaro REAR seatbelts in Dark Ash Gray, which is the same color as my truck interior. The best part is they're essentially NEW (8000 miles on car), and were only $8.99 per PAIR ($18 shipping). So I bought them. I hope they work. :)

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/-xEAAOSwJ2teQcls/s-l1600.jpg

[Belair-o]

Good sluething! Not sure how you found that needle in the haystack, but good job!

[chevynut]

Good sluething! Not sure how you found that needle in the haystack, but good job!

Thanks, and I hope that's the end of my seatbelt saga. I thought for sure my 2003 Silverado belt latch would work but I had no idea there were two widths for them. When my 2019 Sierra latch worked, I did some searching for Chevy "Dark Ash Gray" belts and found out that color was used in 2017-2019 Volts and a few other cars, and almost bought a new set for the rear seat of a Volt at what I thought was a low price of $20 each.

I then got the actual part number off of the latch in my Sierra and googled it, and somehow ran across the 2017 ZL-1 Camaro belts on eBay. I was shocked at the low price and with only 8000 miles on the car they may not have ever been used. I googled 2017 Camaro interior colors and found they used Jet Black and "Medium Ash Gray" belts in those years of Camaros, so I contacted the seller and he said they were gray. I hope they're the right width, but the seller never answered my question about that. I guess for $8.99 a pair it wasn't worth it for him to check...LOL! I thought about going to a car lot and trying them but it was too much bother and I've been busy with family over the past week. We'll see if they work......

[chevynut]

Got the setbelts done. I cut the Camaro belts to remove the latches because the belt end loops wouldn't slide through them. I don't think these latches had ever been used. Then I had to cut the new belt loops off to install the latches and we sewed new loops on them. Here they are re-assembled. They only hang out about 38" which should be about perfect. Now I need to install them in the car.

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[55 Rescue Dog]

Wow, nice job.

[chevynut]

The belts turned out just about perfect. There's a fine line on the length of the belt because the spool can only hold so much webbing. The retracted length can't be longer than the distance from the lower anchor, through the shoulder loop, and to the retractor. Then when extended it has to be long enough to go around you and latch. My 120" belt is about 38" retracted and the stowed length is about 47-48". So the belt is only extended 10" or so from the full spool condition. When latched around me, I have 12" or so of belt left, enough for 3-4 turns of webbing on the spool. That should be enough to keep it from pulling out in an accident. The 133" belts, while only 13" longer, won't stow properly on the b-pillar unless the mounting points are carefully thought out to take up the 57" of slack (what mine had). That much slack left me around 10" of loose belt on the floor.

Here's the belts installed. The sliding latch is laying near the floor since the stop button isn't installed yet. You can see the anchor plate for the retractor with the 7/16" grade 8 bolt holding it in place in the quarter panel area. I also welded an anchor plate at the bottom of the b-pillar, inside the quarter panel. I put the shoulder loop a little lower than I initially wanted to, so that the belt was parallel to the door jamb instead of hanging over the opening. It works good.

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Here's a pic showing how good the access is to the release button with the sliding latch.

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Now I have to figure out how to make a sleeve to hide the belt behind the headliner and protect it from wear.

[55 Rescue Dog]

Are you going to install a seatbelt warning light? All the new cars have them.