More interior work done

[WagonCrazy]

all good news Laszlo. Carry on my wayward son! Ther'll be peace when you are done. Lay your weary head to rest. Dontcha cry no more.

[chevynut]

I went down to Ron's today to talk to him about my interior. I took a door panel, console sides, valences, and a few other parts so he could look at them.

First we talked about the situation with Larry and Ron said he cautioned him about getting an attorney involved. He also cautioned me but I told him I would if I had to because I won't let Larry screw me over. I asked him if he did an interior for me 10 years ago and didn't pay for it, if I could just settle with him today and pay his 10 year old shop rate, and he said no. I told him that's what I think Larry expects. 10 years ago Larry was charging $40 and hour and I was charging $65. A year ago Ron was at $80. Today Ron is at $90. I used a shop rate of $130 for chassis work which I was told is the going rate....$125-140. I told Ron I think that's fair and he said he agreed. Interesting that it's also double what I was charging 10 years ago.

I sent the letter Certified Mail today to Larry with the charges for his frames. I gave him 30 days to reply to me.

Ron asked if I had talked to Dave, the other guy who wants to do my car. I have, and I told him my concerns. I still prefer that Ron does my car because I've seen some of his work, and his reputation is the best interior shop in Colorado. He's also half the distance from me, and Dave's shop rate is $100 even though he works out of a shop at his house. When I talked to Dave I asked him to come look at my car and give me an estimate of time to complete it. He said he'd do that but it wouldn't be a quote...fair enough.

Ron looked over my parts that I'm not quite ready to release to a shop, and he said he could work with them. He said he could tell I did a lot of work on the interior already and said he was impressed with what I had done. I told him I still want to do some more fiberglass work on the door and side panels, and more metalwork on the console. Not sure how that's going to happen.

Ron's big concern is that he can't get my car into his shop until "spring" which he said was April or so. A year ago I could have gotten it in early this year. A couple months ago he said December. I told him depending on how much work I can do, and when, that might still work for me. I asked him to pencil me in.

He also offered to see if one of his guys would come up to my house and install the dash. I told him that would be awesome, and it would give me a lot of work to do after that. He said he couldn't get anyone up there until mid-September or so, but that works great with my schedule because that's about when I'll be coming back from Montana.
After that's done, I can assemble everything outside the car and under the dash, and all that will be left is interior work.

Ron said that the person doing the seats should be the same as the one doing the rest of the interior too, so he isn't going to do anything on them until I decide between him and Dave. Not a big problem for me except still no foam on the rear seats.

My plan is to get either Ron's guy or Dave to come up to my place and install the dash leather. I hope Ron's guy can do it, because I don't think Dave will do it unless I commit to having him do the whole interior. I don't want to be stuck there until I decide.

I picked up my visors which as I thought Larry didn't do a damn thing with. I got the cloth for the visors and picked up the seat boards to put in the car so his guy can see everything installed if/when he comes up. In retrospect I should have left the visors there and asked him to do them if he had some slack time.

So I still really don't know where I'm going with this, but at least there's hope of getting the dash installed. I did pick up the dash leather and brought it home. Oh, Gary asked how many hours Ron thought it would take to do the dash, and he said 3-5. That's EXACTLY what I estimated....I've always said 4 hours or about half a day. Larry couldn't even find that, but it would probably have taken him 3 trips of 4 hours each.

[chevynut]

Well it's been almost a week since I sent the certified letter to Larry and have heard nothing. I'm not going to do anything until 30 days has passed, but I at least expect him to come back and negotiate the settlement. If he totally ignores me, I will see an attorney about going after him.

I asked Ron to verify that he had all my materials and he said he did. I also asked Ron if he had talked to his guy about installing my dash pad at my shop and he said they prefer to do it at their shop. So I'll have to trailer the car down there if I can't find anyone else to do it. He said I can make an appointment and they'd have the car 2-4 days......for 3-5 hours of work. What a pain.

I prefer to have Ron's guy do the dash because it sounds like they've done this before. He said they need to put the 1/8" foam on it and sand it smooth before they glue the leather on.

If I have to take the car down to Ron's shop I'm going to have him also install the foam on the rear seats. That way I can finish the rear console the way I want to. I plan to take it down with the entire interior installed so they can see what it looks like now, and tell me what I need to do to get it ready for them to finish it.

[chevynut]

I've been up in Montana since August 20th and Larry's response was due to me September 5th. I had forgotten to send the letter via e-mail to him as as I intended (as well as certified mail) so I sent it to him on August 27th and mentioned that I hadn't seen anything since was gone. He replied and said he was sending a response within two days.

What he sent me was a joke. He just re-hashed everything about the past, his shop problems, and his daughter's passing 2 1/2 years ago. He explanined what our agreement was, and went on about how I changed things, and it took me so long to finish the car, and on and on. The bottom line is he claimed I still owed him for the charcoal leather, which is paid for. He claims that his work is worth as much as mine, and his hours should offset mine, despite the fact that at the time we made the first agreement, we agreed to offset hours based on our differing shop rates...his was $40 per hour, mine was $65, consistent with other shops doing chassis work. He claimed that he had 20 hours cutting out and sewing up my headliner, and that the steering wheel took him 4 hours. I was told sewing up a Nomad headliner was 6-8 hours of work if you had a pattern, which he did. I was also told that covering a split steering wheel was maybe one hour. It's a few screws, cutting leather strips and gluing them on, trimming it, and re-assembling it. He also claimed he could have bought a Morrison chassis, and showed me what my frame conversions cost from a post on this site. Bottom line, is he claims he owes me less than half of what I calculated.

I replied and told him I wasn't going to argue about the past anymore, and that our first agreement to exchange labor was superceded by my agreement to modify his 59 Corvette Morrison frame in exchange for unlimited labor on my interior to "finish" it. I told him that he owed me an interior, and we needed to figure out how I was going to be compensated for my work so that my interior work would be covered. His accounting of everything was all mish-mash with charges and credits mixed up. I rejected his offer and told him I would send him another letter when got home, and this had to be settled soon or I was going to take legal action if we can't come to some agreement how to do this.

I'm going to force him to finish the accounting for materials because he actually owes me. There is no way I'm going to let him credit me at below my shop rate at the time I built his frames, nor will I pay an equivalent shop rate for his work. Chassis work is a lot more expensive than interior work, even today. I'm going to counter-offer for everything he did at a reasonable number of shop hours, as well as the actual hours I watched him do work at my shop. No way does cutting and sewing a headliner take 20 hours. I think he's trying to make me pay for his first botched attempt.

At least we have two stakes in the sand, but we're a long ways apart. But he admits he owes me.

[chevynut]

Significant changes in the past month. I have been working on settling with Larry and we debated lots of things in my settlement offer. In the end, he offered me a couple of options. First, he said he'd pay me what I billed him down to the last dollar. His other offer was to keep working with me on the interior. He said he is almost done with his shop and that he would be moving in in November, and could start working more or less full time on my car. He was having his floors epoxied this week so he said he could come and install my dash. He also said he would enter into a contract with me, which he has always pushed back on. He said he would work with Ron on getting the foam on the rear seat boards by Thanksgiving, which is what I told him I wanted. I agreed to have him install the dash, and work on a contract. The contract will itemize the main elements of the project including time or cost, so if he bails on me before he's done we know what he owes me. I have to say, I have been impressed with his cooperation.

On Tuesday he came over and picked up the dash leather that I got from Ron. He said he had to trim the seam and get it ready to install. He came over today and did the installation. I'm ecstatic with the way it turned out. I love the colors and the workmanship is top notch, as I knew it would be. He installed it in about 6 hours. I hope the next step goes as smoothly.

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[Belair-o]

Chevynut,
Amazing his change in attitude! And your new shop moving right along now!
Have you considered buying a lottery ticket? You may be on a roll!
Regards, Doug

[chevynut]

I decided that I wanted to keep the fresh air vents since the Vintage Air has no way of getting outside air into the car. So I used a pair of Danchuk cardboard kick panels and cut them to fit, then used them as a pattern to make a pair out of .050" aluminum. I'm using the stock grilles and cables, and I removed the flapper valves, cleaned them up, painted them, and reinstalled them. The seals were good.

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I've been doing some more work to finish the console. I cut the holes for the window and lock switches and installed them. I'm now working on final touches on the top, which will be covered in orange carbon fiber (orange kevlar and carbon fiber weave). I felt the Hurst shifter was a little too tall, so I cut it down 1" and welded it back together. I also machined a stainless bushing for the leather shifter boot. My machinist friend will cut the shifter boot bezel out of stainless steel. There will be three screws in the stainless trim where the cleco is, which I can remove and remove the front half of the top panel to access my fuses and other electronics. The rear half comes off easily with the shifter knob removed.


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Next projects are to assemble the A/C ducts, A/C and heater controls, glove box, and instruments. I also need to figure out how to mount the fresh air vent cables.

[chevynut]

i could see my wiring and the Vintage Air ECU so I wanted to black out the area behind the speaker grille. I also needed a plate with nuts on it to screw the bezel screws into that normally went into the speakers frame. So I fabbed this plate to kill two birds with one stone. I still have to paint it flat black.

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[chevynut]

It's been a while since I posted here. I've been gone a lot the past few months to Montana, SEMA, and Mexico and finally got back home in early December and got back to work on the car. Seems like the site is working better.

I've finished smoothing and gapping the rear side panels and the rear armrests and they're ready for Larry to cover in leather. I made brackets to hold the armrests against the panels and raised the back of the armrests slightly to better match the cargo area level. I've also been working on building the attachment between the front and rear consoles, and I have the front console sides primed and blocked. They're almost ready to cover, but I still have to finalize the curve between the front and rear consoles and finish that area up.

I have sanded off the woodgrain on the "spears" for the rear side panels and door panels, and I'm getting ready to apply the carbon fiber on them. I've never done that before so it will be interesting. Once I get the cloth on them, the epoxy should be easy.

Larry put foam on the rear seat boards, but is still working on the bolsters on them. He's coming over tomorrow to mark them so he can finish sculpting the foam. Then I can finish the design of the rear console.

I've been working with my machinist friend to cut some custom dash trim. I did the design work in Autocad and he's cut one prototype to check out the tool path. He's trying to get me a part that I can try to form to the dash, or make whatever modifications we need to make to fit it. Then we'll cut the other pieces and I can finish assembling the dash. I have the heater and A/C controls in and verified that they work, and have run the A/C vent hoses which was a real challenge with all the stuff under the dash.

I'm now working on the door panels and have them smoothed and gapped, except for the speaker openings and the armrests, which are removable. I hope to have them completely done by next week so Larry can take them and cover them.

Larry has also covered the kick panels I made, and I decided to keep the vent grilles but they will be painted the tan leather color. They're now just SPI epoxy primer.

Finally, I have the valences finished and they're ready to cover too. We just need to finalize the gaps between the valences and the console.



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[567chevys]

Laszlo , Looks Great !!! Do you have any pictures from your Trips ?? also new cars don't come with cigarette Lighters in the dash

[chevynut]

Laszlo , Looks Great !!! Do you have any pictures from your Trips ?? also new cars don't come with cigarette Lighters in the dash

Sid, I have a bunch of pictures from SEMA and will post a few from Montana on another thread. As far as the lighter, I struggled with that a little. I'd rather not have it there, but the light switch is on the other side so it kinda balances it. Also, I want a lighter outlet somewhere for a tire pump and anything else with a lighter plug and I don't know where else to put it. There will be a dual USB outlet next to the switches under the stereo.

Here's what the center trim looks like now in the CAD drawing. Th.e line below the colored area is actually a relief cut into the back side for the leather on the dash that comes down 1/2"

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[chevynut]

This morning I sanded the area where the armrests attach to the door panels, and assembled them so Larry can check them out for covering. I glued the aluminum panel on it and made the brackets yesterday. I also plan to add another bracket in the rear to hold the armrest tight to the panel horizontally. If everything is okay, I plan to prime them with SPI epoxy and fill any minor imperfections or anything else that needs to be done. The armrests are removable because there are two screws behind them that attach and precisely locate the panel to the door, otherwise it moves around on the clips. I will cut the top of the armrests down about 3/8" so we can attach foam on top of them. They will end up about at the black line you see on the panels. Looking back at my pictures, these panels were almost done in 2015. That's how long I've been trying to get Larry to do some work on the interior.


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[WagonCrazy]

Great update and great progress Laszlo. Definately moving towards cruising it this summer!

[chevynut]

The past couple of days I've been working on the armrests. I made the top plate that goes under the armrests out of aluminum and fabbed up some brackets that capture the tabs on the door panel. My first attempt at the brackets allowed the armrests to move side to side, so I re-designed them. They now prevent movement side to side. Monday I attached those plates to the bottoms of the armrests using fiberglass resin, and let them cure. I was sick all day tuesday and didn't get out of bed til early evening. Today I sanded down the mating areas and the excess resin, and slid the armrests onto the panels. They fit almost perfectly and come off and go on easily. They're very solid and don't move. So with them attached, I had to make the gaps between the armrests and the panels. Now I have to cut the top of the armrests down either 3/8" or 1/2" for Larry to attach foam to them.

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With the armrests mostly done, I decided to go ahead and prime the panel without the inserts. I used SPI epoxy which I'll try to sand tomorrow. Sometimes I find it doesn't sand very well after 24 hours but does after 48. I also seem to be getting some fisheyes, probably because I tried applying it too thick. It's not a paint job, so it's not that important. Then I need to fill any remaining imperfections and prime again, hopefully finishing the panels . Lastly, I need to do some final fitting and tweaking of the 2 inserts before priming them.


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[chevynut]

Still having some of the same issues with Larry. We agreed that he'd start working regularly on my car December 1, and it would be finished April 30. I gave him 5 months and he said that should be plenty of time. I have a contract written up that he agreed to sign, but we haven't executed it yet. I'm going to get that done, because his behavior hasn't changed that much and he doesn't seem to prioritize my project. The contract stipulates how we deduct his work hours from what he agreed he owed me in cash.

Since he came over December 12th (I got back to CO on December 8) and we discussed a lot of details, he's covered my kick panels, re-covered my visors, and put foam on the rear seat boards. That can't be a weeks' worth of work in the past 6 weeks.

He messed up the visors and left a hole on the opposite end of the attachment to the roof (inboard end). I asked what that hole was for and he said it was for the piece that went inside to attach to the roof.....I told him there was none on a tri5. I originally gave him two INTACT original visors so I don't know where he got the idea that something went in there. We discussed making a "plug" out of stainless to simulate the small stainless clip on the stock visors. That would be acceptable to me......if he did it. I don't have time to do that with all the work I've been doing and I told him he may just have to re-do them. He's not happy about that, but it's not my problem.

Since December 12 I have put around 120 hours, maybe more, into the rear side panels, rear armrests, door panels, valences, spears, and console, not including the work I did on the headlights. I've worked on the interior almost every day, including weekends, for several hours. The rear panels and armrests were done December 20th, about 8 solid days of work. Since then I've been working on the door panels and console. This is work that he originally said he would do, but I have built the entire interior myself. He said he couldn't do this type of work.

Larry originally only put flat foam on the rear seat boards (as you can see in the pic above) and I asked him how I was supposed to design the rear console without the bolsters on them. I showed him a picture of a pair of seats with all the foam work done, and that's what I told him I was expecting. A week ago (last Friday) he came and checked the fit of the seat boards, and they only had partial bolsters on them and final shaping wasn't done. I asked him to do this stuff a year ago or more, but at least he's working on them. He did some measuring and marking on them (he's very meticulous) and said he'd come back "next week" to check them again. I finally heard from him Friday afternoon and he said he'll be over Monday "late morning".....which typically means noon or later. So there's another full week gone. He typically shows up on Friday afternoons late. Last week it was 2:30 and I told him I needed to be gone by 4. I'm starting to wonder if in his 50 years' experience if he's ever built seats from scratch before. The work I'm asking him to do seems to challenge him, and I've had to suggest ways to do some things.

He also told me that he didn't want to do anything on the rear side panels and armrests until he got the door panels, so he could do them all at the same time. Fair enough....some of it is a little complicated with several lines having to match up on the panels. Ron also has to do all the top-stitching so it's better that he does them all at the same time. I'm also adding some decorative stitching that he's kinda balking on, but I told him I wanted it and he needed to figure out how to make it happen.

So I'm pushing to get the door panels completely done so he can start covering them. There's still a lot of work to be done on the console and the cargo area construction which I want to get to. And I am going to Montana for 2 weeks in early February so I won't be here to get anything done then. The contract has a cancellation clause and I can pull the plug whenever I want to, if he doesn't perform. Then he owes me the settlement amount less the work he's done to that point. But I'm not paying to do things twice.

I am starting to wonder if Larry will even sign the contract now. 6 weeks of the 5 months has gone by already. Tic, tic, tic....