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Thread: wagon progress

  1. #21
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP&C View Post
    Rick's source is the same gentleman I mentioned above, and if he says it's so, you can hold it as gospel.
    Okay then I don't get it. Your driver's door clearly doesn't drop in the rear as much as the passenger door. It's also flatter than my sedan door, which is just like your passenger door. That tells me there is a difference between a wagon door and a sedan door, at least on the driver's side. Why would the passenger side be any different? What am I missing? You said yourself that rumor was GM ran out of wagon doors and started using sedan doors, which sounds plausible if your door is the original one to the car. To me that says there were two different doors in use.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
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    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
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  2. #22
    Registered Member MP&C's Avatar
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    Laszlo, I measured window openings after adding that section in the passenger side, and the distance at the back end of the passenger side is about 1/8+ over what I measured toward the front of the window opening. By comparison, the driver's side measured to be about 1/32 taller at the rear than what was measured toward the front. So by that comparison, the doors would appear to be the same, at least at the window openings, before I had made any changes. I also measured at the back of the door opening against the b post, from under the drip rail to the "crest" of the beltline crease, and both measured at/about (if I remember correctly) 16-1/8. Both the same. So I guess more measurements are in order...
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  3. #23
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    Cnut, why would there be a difference in the shape between a driver door or car versus a passenger door or car, other than the obvious that it' s a mirror image.

    Further to that, check out listings for glass - it's the same piece for all.

    I don't know if you know or know of Michael Domoracki - he is definitely an expert on 55-57s. And a very exacting craftsman. I think he's been doing this at least 35 years. One of his specialties is stainless repair and polishing.

  4. #24
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Rick, based on Robert's pics the doors appear different to me and obviously to him too. If they weren't, why did he have to add what looks like 3/8" - 1/2" to the passenger door height? It sounds like this is a common occurrence on 2-door wagons - on the passenger side - based on what Robert said in his first post about the doors. But apparently it doesn't show up on all wagons. So something is different from side to side on his car. Did they just make some of the passenger side doors wrong? Is the b-pillar height wrong there? Or did they just use sedan doors sometimes on that side as the "rumor" suggests? Was this only in 55, or in 56 and 57 too?

    I always thought the roofline drip rail on the wagons was straight, therefore the doors would have to be straight along the top. According to Robert the drip rail is not straight on his wagon, which seems a bit odd to me. In fact, Robert's measurements of the window opening show that the top of the door is just about parallel with the beltline, which I believe is parallel with the rocker. So how can it not be straight?

    So I don't know what's going on and don't doubt that Mr. Domoracki knows a lot about these cars. However, I don't believe any one person knows everything there is to know about them. And it's of no consequence to me since I don't own a non-Nomad wagon. It's just a curiosity to me.

    So what's your theory as to why Robert had to add so much to the passenger door to make it fit right?
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  5. #25
    Registered Member MP&C's Avatar
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    I actually only added a smidge more than 1/8", the patch was cut wider to get the weld seams farther apart to limit any weld distortion. What I cut out was slightly over 1/4, the patch strip was cut at 7/16 wide, and had some sanded off in final fitment. The cuts on the rear post also had some slight touchup to straighten things up. I think the camera makes it look fatter than it is..
    Last edited by MP&C; 12-29-2014 at 07:16 AM.
    Robert



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  6. #26
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    I'm not doubting that the problem exists, after all we have photographic proof.

    I'd say it's a factory quality problem. It also has me thinking I need to check the doors on my sedan, as well as the openings. I do expect them to be okay though.

    FWIW, Domoracki was reporting the same problem on his wagon. He had a different repair in mind than Robert's but didn't elaborate.
    Last edited by Rick_L; 12-29-2014 at 08:34 AM.

  7. #27
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    This is strange. I measured my driver's door on my sedan and from the bottom of the window opening to the top of the window opening it's 13" in front, and 13 3/8" in the rear. Then I measured from the bottom of the window opening to the top of the door and it's 14 1/2" in front and 14 15/16" in the rear.

    The top of the door rolls down at the rear, so this suggested to me that the beltline is NOT parallel with the rocker as I thought it was. So I measure it and it's 30" in front and 29 3/8" at the rear from the bottom of the door to the top of the door skin, below the bend. This makes the door about 9/16" shorter in the back overall than the front.

    I also noticed that my Nomad beltline was lower in the rear than in the front, even with the frame level. So these cars have a slight "reverse rake" on the body, it seems.

    My sedan doors definitely have a curvature to them on top, with the rear of the door 9/16" below the front as I just measured. It seems strange to me that they would have used these same doors on a wagon, but I guess it's possible. It's hard to believe 9/16" could be a quality issue. My doors fit my sedan body perfectly.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  8. #28
    Registered Member MP&C's Avatar
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    OK, some unofficial measurements... It's kinda late for me to measure door differences, so here are the details behind the door.









    Starting at the passenger side from the bottom of the drip rail, it's 1-1/8 to the crest of the upper trim, 15-31/32 to crest of lower trim, and 16-7/32 to the start of the quarter. So throwing out the drip rail in case of differing heights, crest to crest is 14-27/32, and crest to qtr bend is 15-3/32.


    Now on the drivers side from the bottom of the drip rail, it's 1-1/16 to the crest of the upper trim, 15-29/32 to crest of lower trim, and 16-3/32 to the start of the quarter. So throwing out the drip rail in case of differing heights, crest to crest is 14-27/32, and crest to qtr bend is 15-1/32.

    So for whatever it's worth, crest to crest appears the same, and upper crest to top of quarter appears to have a 1/16 difference. Anyone care to measure some door details from crest to crest and upper crest to "top of qtr"?






    Robert



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  9. #29
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Robert, on my sedan at the back of the driver's door the measurements are 1 1/16" from the drip rail to the top crest, 14 13/16" from crest to crest, and 15" from top crest to top of quarter. That's within 1/32 of your measurements on the driver's side. I can't get to the passenger side of my sedan because of the stuff around it.

    Seems like that says a wagon door opening is exactly the same as a sedan door opening. So why did your passenger door not fit?
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  10. #30
    Registered Member MP&C's Avatar
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    I believe there may be a difference in the doors, but it's a bit too late for me to measure these..
    Robert



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