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Thread: Ain't much of a garage to brag about...

  1. #11
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    That grounding crap really gets complicated and how you do it seems to depend on where you live. Some places require you to tie neutral to ground and other places prohibit it, even though it's essentially the same thing in the end. And like you said it depends on if there's a ground at the house panel. I had to drive a rod into the ground and tie ground to it, but I think I had to connect neutral to ground in the panels in both shops, even though there's one at the house 100 feet away. I don't know why you would NOT want to do that.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

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  2. #12
    Registered Member WagonCrazy's Avatar
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    Yes to all. The Neutral bus bar in the service panel is tied to the Ground bus bar. That is then tied to the grounding rods...

    Hopefully, my system works as it should in the event of "over draw" on any individual line... That being to cause the breaker to shut off first INSTEAD OF melting a wire somewhere inside the house causing a fire...
    1957 Nomad- LS1/T56 on C4 chassis
    1959 Fleetside Apache 1/2 ton, shortbed, big window, 327ci.

  3. #13
    Registered Member BamaNomad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WagonCrazy View Post
    ...
    Hopefully, my system works as it should in the event of "over draw" on any individual line... That being to cause the breaker to shut off first INSTEAD OF melting a wire somewhere inside the house causing a fire...
    The KEY to that is to make sure that you always choose your wiring to handle MORE current than the breaker on your circuit... (I always go a size larger on the wire than is recommended for safety, but that does cause more issues when installing, and more cost)...

  4. #14
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BamaNomad View Post
    The KEY to that is to make sure that you always choose your wiring to handle MORE current than the breaker on your circuit... (I always go a size larger on the wire than is recommended for safety, but that does cause more issues when installing, and more cost)...
    Actually the wires can handle WAY more current than required by code. It takes a lot of current to fuse even a 20 gauge wire. I wouldn't recommend using a larger wire than recommended because it's a lot harder to handle and it costs a lot more with the price of copper nowadays as you said.....so why do it? You need 14 gauge for a 15A circuit and 12 gauge for a 20A circuit per electrical codes.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  5. #15
    Registered Member BamaNomad's Avatar
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    You are correct Chevy nut... 14 gauge for 15A breaker circuits, and 12 gauge for 20A breaker circuits is CODE, and is sufficient for those circuits, but in my garages I've built, I install 12 gauge for all, even if I'm putting in 15A breakers on some. My reason for this is that I once bought a 'hot water/pressure cleaner' (which I love btw and always use cleaning 'new OLD cars I buy)... When I first used it, plugging into the closest outlet I had in my garage at the time, for cleaning under a car outside, after a few minutes, the 15A breaker got hot and popped. So I had find a 20A circuit outlet for that ... and later changed out that breaker for a 20A breaker (I'd wired the entire garage with 12G individual wires in metal conduit, so it was no big deal)...

    In a house, 14 gauge is typically all that is used for the standard circuits, but in the garages I've built, I wire with 12G, even with the pains with terminating the ends...

  6. #16
    Registered Member 55 Rescue Dog's Avatar
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    I wired all my garage receptacle circuits with 12ga using 15 amp breakers and outlets to have the option to change any circuit to 20 amp. Plus 12ga has less resistance, and voltage drop on bigger loads. I also use wire numbers to identify everything later if needed. If my house was wired like my garage, I could run like 20 crock pots, and more. I was lucky enough to have my local utility run a separate underground 100 amp service to my garage, plus fiber optic.
    Last edited by 55 Rescue Dog; 12-10-2016 at 01:23 PM.

  7. #17
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    BamaNomad, I would think that a hot water high pressure washer would pull more than 15 amps, do you know what the current rating is for it? It probably needs a 20A circuit anyhow.

    IMO if you're going to put the 12 gauge wire in, I see no reason not to use 20A breakers from the get-go. Why "upgrade" to 20A breakers later? The breakers are meant to protect the wiring in the structure. Personally I wouldn't wire a shop with anything less than 20A wires and breakers.

    Both of my shops are wired with 12 gauge wires and 20A breakers except for my compressor circuits which are 10GA 30A 220V and welder circuits 6GA 50A 220V. I even used 12 gauge on lighting circuits. I have GFI outlets at the beginning of each 120V circuit and they can sometimes be a PITA but are required by our codes. In my new shop they required "tamper proof" outlets which are BS in a shop, imo, and make it hard to plug things in.

    I run a large Jet 12" disc/belt sander, another 12" sander, my shop vac that's connected to my bead blaster, a drill press, and my Jet horizontal bandsaw on the same circuit on one wall and I usually don't have problems but it's close when my son and I both work and we've tripped the breaker there. I've made plans to split that circuit in two and the new wire is already run from the panel to where I need to cut the circuit. My plasma cutter is pretty much on it's own 20A 110V circuit unless I need to cut heavier material, then I plug it into 220V. I have one 220V welder outlet at each end of the old shop and one in the new shop in case I ever need to weld there . We usually use a 220V extension cord for the 180A TIG and I can plug my Miller 211 MIG into 110V or 220V.

    For lighting, in the old shop I have 8 4-foot fluorescent fixtures with 4 bulbs each and in the new shop there's 11 of them with 4 bulbs each. The old attic has six 60 watt LED bulbs and the new attic has four 4-foot fluorescent 2-bulb fixtures. I find the LED bulbs give more light than incandescent, and CFLs are worthless.

    And you're right about voltage drop. For extremely long runs it does make sense to use larger wire but 20GA should work just about anywhere.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  8. #18
    Registered Member BamaNomad's Avatar
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    We get by in our home 'one man' shops with putting more equipment on the circuits than it would support, but we can only operate ONE at a time, eh?

  9. #19
    Registered Member chevynut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BamaNomad View Post
    We get by in our home 'one man' shops with putting more equipment on the circuits than it would support, but we can only operate ONE at a time, eh?
    You don't need to design a circuit to support having everything on at once. If we did that, we'd need a 1000 amp panel to our homes.

    I have several 110V circuits in both shops. Unfortunately I didn't plan to have so much equipment on one wall in the old shop because I didn't originally build it for a business. Still, it all works with no problem 99% of the time even with two of us working.
    56 Nomad, Ramjet 502, Viper 6-speed T56, C4 Corvette front and rear suspension

    You can see my 56 Nomad build here http://www.picturetrail.com/chevynut

    For affordable C4 Corvette Suspension conversions for your car, visit http://www.classicedgedesigns.com

    Other vehicles:

    56 Chevy 2-door BelAir sedan
    56 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    57 Chevy 210 4-door sedan
    1961 Willys CJ3B Jeep
    2001 Porsche Boxster S
    2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax

  10. #20
    Registered Member WagonCrazy's Avatar
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    In my new shop they required "tamper proof" outlets which are BS in a shop, imo, and make it hard to plug things in.
    And with final inspection long since completed, I'm sure you've solved that by replacing those with the old fashioned ones...

    BTW. Thanks for describing all the circuits and uses in your old/new garage. I'm in the process of trying to figure out what I want for wiring in the new garage (still in the design phase in my head at this point).
    1957 Nomad- LS1/T56 on C4 chassis
    1959 Fleetside Apache 1/2 ton, shortbed, big window, 327ci.

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